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Kava Preparation Amylase for Traditional Prep

EQ

Atman
I only have this discomfort after the Borogu, I think the problem is that I don't have good memories with Borogu, but I decided to try it again anyway with a different prep method but it's just no good for me. I actually feel myself get tense and agitated when preparing the kava because my mind starts thinking about the local an aesthetic properties and it starts to feel like my head is going numb but in an entirely unpleasant way. I don't think set and setting is the problem because my set and setting were just as bad with 'Ono as it was with BKH Waka and Borogu but the 'Ono actually changed my mood from bad to good. Idk, there's something about 'Ono that uplifts the spirits, and something about the others that sends them plummeting, so I think it's pharmacological rather than mind set related. Unless, of course, my bad memory influenced my perception in anyway.
I think it is always a mix of both.
You are needing some mood upliftment Kava's. I am sure if more experienced Kava drinkers than me read this they can make some recommendations.
The Tongan Kava's are very peaceful, Social, and light. Kavafied has some Tongan's and I would recommend trying some of their root, but maybe Pouni Ono will just be your jam.
 

Blinkyrocket

Kava Enthusiast
I think it is always a mix of both.
You are needing some mood upliftment Kava's. I am sure if more experienced Kava drinkers than me read this they can make some recommendations.
The Tongan Kava's are very peaceful, Social, and light. Kavafied has some Tongan's and I would recommend trying some of their root, but maybe Pouni Ono will just be your jam.
I got some Solomons on the way, but right after ordering it I remembered that I wanted to buy Tongan Choice from I think The Kava Roots or something like that. Oh well, I'm not made of money and my birthday approaches, so it's all good.
And yeah, I checked Kavafied and absolutely everything there is sold out.
 
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Alia

'Awa Grower/Collector
I only have this discomfort after the Borogu, I think the problem is that I don't have good memories with Borogu, but I decided to try it again anyway with a different prep method but it's just no good for me. I actually feel myself get tense and agitated when preparing the kava because my mind starts thinking about the local an aesthetic properties and it starts to feel like my head is going numb but in an entirely unpleasant way. I don't think set and setting is the problem because my set and setting were just as bad with 'Ono as it was with BKH Waka and Borogu but the 'Ono actually changed my mood from bad to good. Idk, there's something about 'Ono that uplifts the spirits, and something about the others that sends them plummeting, so I think it's pharmacological rather than mind set related. Unless, of course, my bad memory influenced my perception in anyway.
It is hard to understand this since Borogu, generally, is such a celebrated kava. Have you tried different sources / vendors?
 

Blinkyrocket

Kava Enthusiast
It is hard to understand this since Borogu, generally, is such a celebrated kava. Have you tried different sources / vendors?
If you're talking about different sources of Borogu, than no. I'm still trying to figure it out as well.

I just had 6.5 tablespoons of Borogu after eating, and I feel great. My theory now is either I have low blood sugar when I wake up in the mornings, or low doses work, or placebo.
 
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kastom_lif

Kava Lover
Lower end temps favor
starch breakdown to simpler sugars, higher temps favor breakdown to more complex sugars.
Starch helps pull kavalactones into aqueous suspension. Kavalactones are not very water soluble.

If the amylase converts all available starch to sugar, it may cause the KL's to precipitate or bind to something else.
 

Alia

'Awa Grower/Collector
If you're talking about different sources of Borogu, than no. I'm still trying to figure it out as well.

I just had 6.5 tablespoons of Borogu after eating, and I feel great. My theory now is either I have low blood sugar when I wake up in the mornings, or low doses work, or placebo.
Good! definitely worth experimenting this way.
 

Chronophan

Kava Curious
This is an interesting topic and I appreciate the discussion. Before reading this thread I was about to buy some brewers supply amylase from Amazon but hadn't considered that it required a temperature higher than the maximum temperature for kavalactones, or that reducing starches might reduce kavalactone transfer into the water suspension.

When I first tried Kava back in the 70's I read about the traditional preparation and assumed that both the chemistry and physics of chewing was important. I suspect that Kava may have been first chewed fresh and that the preparation of the beverage may have evolved in respect to elders who had lost their teeth. From what I read back in the 70's some preparations followed mastication with letting the beverage "ferment" in an earthen vessel left in a cool stream for a week, though I didn't see that step in the process described as often as just the pre-chewing. In what I read, mastication was said to be preformed by young people, who's saliva would would have contained a healthier mix of natural antibiotics, enzymes, electrolytes, and mucus. While I agree that the loss of starch from the action of amylase might limit suspension of kavalactones in water, and I have no idea whether the lipase would have any effect on kavalactone chemistry, I suspect that the mucopolysaccharides in saliva might effectively carry kavalactones in water.

I would be grateful to hear about anyone else's experiences experimenting with replicating the chemistry of chewing kava.
 
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Chronophan

Kava Curious
Considering that chewing with the amylase enzymes in saliva cleaves some of the starch in the root into dextrin, I tried a simple experiment mixing ¼ tsp cheap clear water soluble dextrin from Walmart to two tablespoons GHK Mo'i Medium Grind Awa in eight ounces cold well water on a magnetic stirrer for ten minutes. I did the same with a control batch and compared the two after they settled for a half our and after one hour. The solution with the dextrin looked darker that the one without the dextrin. After straining and pressing though a gold metal coffee screen the dextrin solution seemed stronger and was of course smoother that the solution without the dextrin.

Longer stir times improved the mix. I repeated the process using ½ teaspoon of dextrin and the result seemed even better. I'm guessing that the dextrin might be more effective carrying kavalactones in water than plain starch from the root but I have no way to measure the actual effectiveness other than appearance and subtle difference in subjective effect. In any case, since dextrin is one of the natural products of chewing starch, it adds nothing to the mix that wouldn't be there if kava beverage was prepared in the traditional method by chewing so I do not believe it poses any of the risks of solvents or emulsifiers. I've also noticed that the solution with a little dextrin doesn't gum up the gold plated coffee screen as much as the plain water solution does. The results are sufficient for me to continue to use this method.

Its certainly much easier than chewing medium grind kava!
 
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Blinkyrocket

Kava Enthusiast
I think it is always a mix of both.
You are needing some mood upliftment Kava's. I am sure if more experienced Kava drinkers than me read this they can make some recommendations.
The Tongan Kava's are very peaceful, Social, and light. Kavafied has some Tongan's and I would recommend trying some of their root, but maybe Pouni Ono will just be your jam.
I think it's worth mentioning that I no longer experience this negative effect from Borogu, or any other Kava for that matter. I am, as well, absolutely confused as to why I had a negative experience with Kava all that time ago, but oh well. :p
 

Saghloqh

Kava Curious
Really strange that this thread popped up today. It's been a while since I've read the forum but I came across a bottle of digestive enzyme complex capsules, which contain amylases and cellulases among other enzymes.

I tried a prep of about 1/2 cup kava to 1 cup warm water (Around 40 degrees celcius), with 1 capsule put in. I let it sit for about 20 minutes with occasional stirring, then put some apple cider vinegar in because I don't know my enzyme MoA's super well and wanted to mimic the environment of the stomach a bit more. Another 20 mins of stirring and sitting.

Now, I always prepare my kava by light simmering first - not enough to even start simmering, really, but high enough temp to have an oily sheen appear on top of the water when the starch starts breaking down. So I did the same this time.

Then I strained it, and I noticed two things:

First, I use a piece of an old shirt for my kava prep, the same one each time, and this time the kava filtered much, much more easily than it normally does.

The second, quite startling thing - normally, after the boiling method the kava is quite slimy when I'm straining and kneading it. It feels as if no matter how much I knead, there is always oily residue hanging onto the root fibers. This time it wasn't slimy at all... in fact, it was super easy to squeeze every bit of moisture out of the fibers and was left with makkas that were bone dry and much more crumbly than normal. Doing another wash on them resulted in a suspension that is nearly clear, not the light brown opaque suspension that normally results from a second wash.

The batch ended up being fairly strong... It feels as if I did a first and second wash and then combined them, when in reality I only did the single wash.

Overall I'm not convinced it's worth it... It makes it taste funky and with the time spent waiting I could have done two washes easily enough. However, it does seem to be good at getting basically everything out of the fibers.

EDIT: Okay, so of course after I post I realize the kava is hitting me a bit harder than I expected. I've made it through less than a third of the batch (soo 2 and a half tablespoons?) and it's time for a nap.

I normally like to slowly sip my kava (I think it tastes like mother earth) so it's disappointing that I have to chug this batch because of the weird taste, but this method seems to have some merit. One capsule of the enzymes costs 30 cents, so it doesn't have to increase potency much to be worth it.
 
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Chronophan

Kava Curious
Really strange that this thread popped up today. It's been a while since I've read the forum but I came across a bottle of digestive enzyme complex capsules, which contain amylases and cellulases among other enzymes. ....

I tried a prep of about 1/2 cup kava to 1 cup warm water (Around 40 degrees celcius), with 1 capsule put in. I let it sit for about 20 minutes with occasional stirring, then put some apple cider vinegar in because I don't know my enzyme MoA's super well and wanted to mimic the environment of the stomach a bit more. Another 20 mins of stirring and sitting.

Now, I always prepare my kava by light simmering first - not enough to even start simmering, really, but high enough temp to have an oily sheen appear on top of the water when the starch starts breaking down. So I did the same this time.

Then I strained it, and I noticed two things:

First, I use a piece of an old shirt for my kava prep, the same one each time, and this time the kava filtered much, much more easily than it normally does.

The second, quite startling thing - normally, after the boiling method the kava is quite slimy when I'm straining and kneading it. It feels as if no matter how much I knead, there is always oily residue hanging onto the root fibers. This time it wasn't slimy at all... in fact, it was super easy to squeeze every bit of moisture out of the fibers and was left with makkas that were bone dry and much more crumbly than normal. Doing another wash on them resulted in a suspension that is nearly clear, not the light brown opaque suspension that normally results from a second wash.
...
That's a great idea ! :)
After a week using the Walmart clear water soluble dextrin (AKA Equate Sugar Free Fiber Supplement Powder ) separately with both GHK Mo'i Medium Grind Awa and KWK Micronized Tonga Pouni Ono Kava , I tried a batch of GHK Mo'i Medium Grind Awa without dextrin and the result seemed somewhat weak to me today, and the root leftover makkas were slimy like you described. I too had a bottle of digestive enzyme complex capsules in the fridge, (Probiotic GX), which I noticed had Amylase and Lipase like saliva. I warmed up the second wash of the GHK Mo'i Medium Grind Awa to body temperature, added a Probiotic GX capsule, and mixed it on a magnetic stirrer for about forty five minutes. After straining and pressing though a gold stainless steel mesh coffee screen the second wash with enzyme seemed much stronger than the first with no enzyme, in fact it was face numbing which normally doesn't happen to me! Also as you mentioned, the root leftover makkas after the enzyme wash were not slimy and it was much easier to strain and press juice from them though the gold stainless steel mesh coffee screen. The Probiotic GX capsules cost about 76 cents a piece which is over twice the price of your digestive enzyme complex capsules so I'm curious what brand you used.
 
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Saghloqh

Kava Curious
That's a great idea ! :)
After a week using the Walmart clear water soluble dextrin (AKA Equate Sugar Free Fiber Supplement Powder ) separately with both GHK Mo'i Medium Grind Awa and KWK Micronized Tonga Pouni Ono Kava , I tried a batch of GHK Mo'i Medium Grind Awa without dextrin and the result seemed somewhat weak to me today, and the root leftover makkas were slimy like you described. I too had a bottle of digestive enzyme complex capsules in the fridge, (Probiotic GX), which I noticed had Amylase and Lipase like saliva. I warmed up the second wash of the GHK Mo'i Medium Grind Awa to body temperature, added a Probiotic GX capsule, and mixed it on a magnetic stirrer for about forty five minutes. After straining and pressing though a gold stainless steel mesh coffee screen the second wash with enzyme seemed much stronger than the first with no enzyme, in fact it was face numbing which normally doesn't happen to me! Also as you mentioned, the root leftover makkas after the enzyme wash were not slimy and it was much easier to strain and press juice from them though the gold stainless steel mesh coffee screen. The Probiotic GX capsules cost about 76 cents a piece which is over twice the price of your digestive enzyme complex capsules so I'm curious what brand you used.
Enzymedica - is the brand I have. They have a bunch of different complexes but the one I'm using is called Digest Basic. One bottle of 30 capsules was about 10 bucks up here in BC Canada.

Unfortunately I couldn' find anything that was only amylases and cellulases... I'm curious as to what the effects of the other enzymes in the complex are having (if any). There are about 9 different enzymes total.
 

Chronophan

Kava Curious
Enzymedica - is the brand I have. They have a bunch of different complexes but the one I'm using is called Digest Basic. One bottle of 30 capsules was about 10 bucks up here in BC Canada.

Unfortunately I couldn' find anything that was only amylases and cellulases... I'm curious as to what the effects of the other enzymes in the complex are having (if any). There are about 9 different enzymes total.
Thanks!

I ran out of the enzyme product I was using so bought a diffrent one like yours with more types of enzyme. This time I bought the enzymes for the specific purpose of digesting kava as would occur if chewed. At 100 capsules for $9 the product I choose was much less expensive than the previous product, and with containing 13 different enzymes the product is far more diverse than before. Like many other generic digestive enzyme products, the one I tried next was composed of a mix of n.zimes proprietary blend of 10 enzymes, and CereCalase proprietary blend of 3 enzymes, all together providing a variety of starch, cellulose, fat, and protein digesting enzymes including enzymes from papaya (papaian) and from pineapple (bromelain). It's Rite-Aid brand, and called just Digestive Emzymes, but isn't listed on their website.

To do it right it did take longer to process, so I started processing one batch while consuming an earlier batch. I start with about a 1/3 cup 100 degree Fahrenheit water in a pint jar on a magnetic stirrer, mix in a capsule of digestive enzymes, add two tablespoons of ether GHK Mo'i Medium Grind Awa or GHK Hanakapi Ai Medium Grind Awa, and gradually add more boiling water to keep the mix at 100 degrees until the pint jar is full. I add the last bit of hot water I sometime also add a little citric, ascorbic, or L-malic acid to help any acid enzymes, but haven't seen much improvement adding an acid at that stage. I leave the batch mixing on the magnetic stirrer until it cools and the put it in the fridge until ready to strain. After straining I put the beverage back in the fridge to stay cool allow some of the enzymes to continue to react very slowly.

Since I like to make my own carbonated mineral water, recently I've tried adding a pint of Awa prepared with enzymes, to well water, magnesium bicarbonate, a couple other minerals, and then carbonating the whole batch. I've also found that adding a little citric, ascorbic, or L-malic acid at this stage seemed to improve the drink, which may be simply from enhanced carbonation, or possibly the combination of acid, CO2, and remaining enzymes continuing to free up sugars and kavalactones but differently than before. Since chewing adds a little CO2 to what is being chewed carbonation is a little along the line of my original intent. The mix made from the first wash has a lot of solids so it can get foamy like beer if not handled carefully, but the second wash, after giving the enzymes a little more to to react, makes a smooth beverage that doen't need to be shaken before dispensing.
 
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Chronophan

Kava Curious
Ok... carbonated 'awa really doesn't work out very well. I found its ok to carefully add a few ounces of 'awa to come good carbonated mineral water occasionally, but adding carbonated water to 'awa can cause an eruption of foam. While carbonating dilute 'awa works, and looks a little like beer, I didn't find it adds anything to the experience.

Also, although citric and ascorbic acids can highlight the mild fruity favor of fresh high quality Hawaiian 'awa, I found malic acid makes the 'awa taste old and musty.

I tried increasing the temperature of the water it seemed that something was missing in the resulting 'awa compared to keeping the maximum temperature below 115 F or 45 C. The enzymes seemed to work fine at those temperature, making the 'awa easier to filter and getting more kavalactones out in the first wash. For me the biggest benefit to using the enzymes was that it relieved me of the stomach irritation that used to interfere with enjoying a strong batch of 'awa. I stopped using the dextrin in my 'awa for awhile but found using 1/8 to 1/4 tsp with a one or two enzyme caps per 2 Tsp Medium Grind Awa and a pint of water stirred for at least 20 minutes results in a smooth and satisfying 'awa beverage which begins to noticeable in five to ten minutes.

This whole process takes a little time to prepare so I make little batches throughout the day and let it all chill in the fridge in a glass pitcher so I can just relax in the evening and always have some left over that keeps getting smoother in the pitcher overnight. It was interesting to hear from Henry that a kava bar in ny uses a process like this too.


UPDATE: After a week I started to get some uncomfortable effects (tension and agitation) from consuming 'awa beverages made with the broad spectrum enzymes, so I reverted back to using just dextrin and right away returned to good effects and a very weak second wash. I'm getting the idea that the starch in the chewed 'awa converted to dextrin which supported a natural and very specific extraction similar to chromatography, and the broad spectrum digestive enzymes introduced other things that would be best discarded with the makkas.

I also noticed that when I accidentally bumped the gold stainless steel mesh coffee screen a couple times, the 'awa filtered through it faster, so I tried touching the rim of the screen cup with weak vibrating sander and the 'awa filtered through really fast! I checked the second wash from the vibration filtered batch and found that the it didn't have much potency so reduced the overall filter time to less than a minute. I went back to using just a pint cold well water with the 1/4tsp dextrin and 2 Tsp Medium Grind Awa stirred until very little floats, then pour through the vibrated coffee screen which resulted in about four cold strong four ounce drinks in just a couple minutes, which I usually take a few hours to consume. I now collect all the second wash in a clean two liter soda bottle in the fridge and carbonate when the bottle is full, which resulted in an interesting soft drink.
 
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Chronophan

Kava Curious
Since my last posting I've bought some pretty pure amylase packets and found that after making a strong batch of two measuring teaspoons GHK micronized kava a cup of cold water supplemented with 1/2 teaspoon dextrin, adding 0.1 CC of amylase powder eliminated all gas and stomach irritation I'd experienced previously. I also found that after blending 2 measuring tablespoons GHK medium grind with 1/2 teaspoon dextrin in 2 cups cold water and kneading and straining though a mesh bag, adding 0.1 CC of amylase powder eliminated gas and stomach irritation. In both cases I added the amylase powder to a cool mixture and mixed just enough to get it evenly distributed before refrigerating because I wanted to keep the starch fragments fairly intact until consuming so that they could carry the kava lactones for awhile before releasing them. When I tried to provide better conditions for the amylase to breakdown the starches into sugars I got a sticky coating of what was likely kavalactones on my glass, so realized that it was better to keep the mix cool so that the kavalactones could drop out of the water after consumed rather than before. The resulting mix was fast and easier to prepare than previous methods I'd used but certainly wasn't good to keep in a container in a warm car. I transfer the content of one packet of amylase to a small vial, and the use a scant filled 0.15 CC measuring spoon to use approximately 0.1 CC. One amylase packet lasts about a month of my daily kava use, and I bought the packets in a set of four on Amazon. I suggest using as little amylase as possible and not exceeding a few tenths of a CC per day because too much amylase may cause problems. YMMV
 
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