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Featured Health Monitoring Blood work / liver panel / lab results

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by sɥɐʞɐs, Jan 18, 2018.

  1. WaltonGroggins

    WaltonGroggins a.k.a. "Kount Grogula"

    Was it microscopic or gross hematuria?
  2. sɥɐʞɐs

    sɥɐʞɐs ‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾ Review Maestro

    It must be microscopic, or somewhere inbetween. On the few occasions it's happened, it has never been visible during the urination. It shows up later, where drops of urine had splashed back and dried over night. Perhaps when the liquid evaporates, the blood stays behind and becomes visible. If not that, then it would have to be droplets that come out at the very end of your urination.

    There are many other meds that can cause hematuria as well. I'm not sure if it's due to some anti-coagulant property they induce, or if it's literally the sharp crystalline structure of the chemical making microscopic cuts as it exits your body.

    Other causes can be from exercise, kidney stones and trauma...obviously. :eek:::awesomesmiles::
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  3. HeadHodge

    HeadHodge Kneads Kava

    kickboxing is not good for you.
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2018
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  4. Krunkie McKrunkface

    Krunkie McKrunkface Kava Enthusiast

    It's probably nothing, but sometimes, just often enough you want to rule it out by getting checked, terminal hematuria can indicate problems in the bladder or prostate.

    But of course, as you say, lots of different things can cause hematuria, a surprisingly long list.
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  5. recentreturn

    recentreturn Kava Enthusiast

    I mentioned in another thread that my kidney numbers were off and that I am hoping that is just from the creatine monohydrate I've been taking (and dehydration/exercise/meat consumption).
    However, I thought I should post my liver-related results as well, which all seem normal to me; but I'm not a doctor:

    Liver Results:
    (July 26, 2018; had been drinking kava pretty much daily [usually a minimum of 5 tbs] and taking a few other meds and supplements; drinking kava pretty continuously for about a year)
    ALT: 18 IU/L (4-33)
    AST: 18 IU/L (13-39)
    ALP: 83 IU/L (34-104)
    Bilirubin: .3mg/dL (.3-1.0)
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2018
  6. Krunkie McKrunkface

    Krunkie McKrunkface Kava Enthusiast

    fwiw I am still constantly being tested because of my conditions and my liver numbers are always good, as are the kidneys. I just stopped posting because it's just good numbers on those without any changes. Oh, and I now drink just 8 TBS medium grind a day but I prep grog so efficiently that it is the same quantity and strength of grog as when I was drinking 12 TBS a day. I don't think I am consuming more or less kava, what changed is I throw less good kava away.
  7. Go Krunk Yourself

    Go Krunk Yourself Kava Enthusiast

    Liver and Kidney numbers are great, also on Statin and SSRI and they're still good, so that says something.
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  8. mrwaka

    mrwaka New Member

    Hey all, been a lurker in here for a the forum.

    I've been a pretty heavy Kava drinker, 10-12 tbsp a day, depending on the day. When I first got into this, I decided it would be a good idea to get blood work done periodically to see if there was any effect. On my last test, although everything was within normal range, I noticed that my GGT and Alkaline Phoshatase were on the higher side of the normal range. Curious, I created a spreadsheet and pivot chart to see what all my liver tests looked like over time.

    To my surprise, during the period of using Kava, both of these values steadily went up, while my Bilirubin, AST and ALT either remained basically the same. Below is that chart.

    I'm using good Kava, e.g. BKA, and others that I've researched on this forum, stuck with noble Kava.

    Maybe it's just me, not sure, I definitely hit it on the harder side, but since I identified this, I just wanted to suggest to my fellow grogheads that anyone getting liver tests, make sure you include GGT and Alkaline Phoshatase also. Most of what I'm seeing people post here is AST, ALT, and Bilirubin, which were all fine for me.

    As a precaution, I'm taking 1-2 months off to see if the values drop again.


    Attached Files:

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  9. mrwaka

    mrwaka New Member

    Follow-up to my post which might be helpful to others, since I saw "but I'm not a doctor". I used a site called LabtestAnalyzer to plug in all of my results (not just liver). Most people, including your doctor, are just looking at the reference range. This site shows you the optimal range. And if not in the optimal range, what the long term impact would be, and also what might be causing it and how to lower it.

    Interestingly, it said for GGT (but not Alkaline Phoshatase, AST, or ALT), "Some supplements can also cause higher GGT levels, including black cohosh and kava [R, R]". One source was for Black Cohosh, and the other Kava. For Kava, it was a 2007 study entitled "Traditional kava beverage consumption and liver function tests in a predominantly Tongan population in Hawaii." which found that Tongan and Non-Tongan residents of Hawaii, where they looked at Kava drinkers and non-Kava drinkers, 65% of the Kava drinkers had elevated GGT whereas 26% of the non-Kava drinkers had an elevation.

    So this particular enzyme may indeed be elevated. Now how much may be a non-issue for some. I just don't want it to keep going up of course.
  10. nashfire

    nashfire Stay Rooted

    Thanks for this! I am a new (1 year) kava daily drinker abd just had my own labs come back from a physical. Liver and kidney panel was great but I will keep an eye on these. Bula!
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  11. sɥɐʞɐs

    sɥɐʞɐs ‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾ Review Maestro

    @mrwaka Here's a discussion on GGT we had once, it's quite long, but if you're curious you'll probably find some good info within it. Perhaps not definitive answers though. I can't recall everything that was said in that thread, but you've probably read in this thread that my Alkaline Phosphatase has always been in range so far, as well as the common ALT, AST and bilirubin markers. GGT is never part of my blood panel, so I have no data there. I've been drinking large daily quantities of kava for many years.

    Where there might be some kava related issue, is with elevated cholesterol or a kava related interference with cholesterol metabolization. Excess cholesterol or abnormal metabolism of cholesterol can create gallstones, the gallbladder is part of the liver system. Therefor, if kava can cause a cholesterol issue, and cholesterol issues can cause gallbladder issues, then the hepatic system might respond with elevated GGT for whatever reason. -- I am not a doctor.

    Additionally, I took a DNA test last year and ran the raw DNA through an additional health analysis. One of the things it found with me, was a gene that's associated with an increased likelihood of having gallbladder issues. I've never been professionally diagnosed with gallstones, but over the years I've experienced pain with the same behavior, intensity and in the same location as what is described when I've read about "gall-attacks". I've had this experience both before I drank kava regularly and after I started drinking regularly.
    So it would seem that this gene very well might be active in me, it's a pretty common gene...anyway...what I'm I'm getting at, is that maybe people with this gene are going to inherently be more susceptible to kava related cholesterol/gallbladder/ggt issues.
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  12. mrwaka

    mrwaka New Member

    @sɥɐʞɐs thanks for the info, appreciate it, will read through that thread. Since you mentioned cholesterol being affected, I went ahead and added those tests along with LDH (another liver test I forgot to mention). And, indeed, my cholesterol went up during the period of measurements.

    So basically, for me, during Kava consumption:

    Negative change:
    - GGT increased by 472%!!
    - LDL increased by 63%
    - Triglycerides increased 33%
    - Alkaline Phoshatase increased by 17%

    Positive change or no change:
    - LDH (liver) decreased 2%
    - HDL increased by 20% (not complaining about that!)
    - ALT decreased by 4%
    - AST decreased by 12%
    - Bilirubin had no change

    Definitely have some concerns about GGT, some for LDL and Triglycerides. The study i referenced said in the summary, "Conclusion: Heavy kava beverage consumption was associated with significantly elevated GGT levels." That's me! Again, this might not be the case for everyone, but I would suggest everyone get that tested if you are monitoring your habits.

    LabAnalyzer (site I mentioned in my initial post, by the way I didn't mention, it is a subscription unfortunately), says: "GGT levels are usually elevated in conditions that cause damage to the liver or the bile ducts (and to a lesser degree, the kidney and pancreas). This blood test is therefore commonly used to help diagnose potential liver and bile-duct disease"

    Like they say though, "In moderation". I was definitely not using in moderation.


    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
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  13. mrwaka

    mrwaka New Member

    I wanted to add another thing, that I think people may not be aware of. If you want to get tests done, but do not want to see your doctor about this, whether it's a hassle or you would rather not discuss this topic (they will likely have no idea what you are talking about and have negative opinions anyway), you can order your own tests without a doctor, completely private.

    I have used a couple of sites online, the one I like best is - you basically pick the tests you want, pay, and you get a lab order. There are two major labs that they work with, which has multiple locations in pretty much in any medium sized city. You hand it to them, they draw your blood, it's online for you the next day, completely private. The test that includes pretty much everything I mentioned except Triglycerides, and LDL, is $34.

    And no I am not affiliated with either of these companies in any way, just use them and think they're useful.
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  14. Henry

    Henry . Moderator The Kava Society of New Zealand

    Elevated ggt is super common among kava drinkers, but, as one scholar explained, in this case it is a sign of adaptation and not a sign of damage.
    I have elevated ggt due to kava and when my doc sees it and I mention kava he says "oh yea, thats normal". I am in nz though and docs here are often familiar with kava
  15. Intrepidus_dux

    Intrepidus_dux Kava Enthusiast

    Hi there @WaltonGroggins . I also have elevated GGT and cholesterol levels. All my other blood work is fine. My doctors encourage me to continue my kava use because it's a safer pain management and anxiety treatment option. My hematologist has not called me in a panic about the GGT test results. It is my understanding that yes, this is common with kava due to high levels of that particular antioxidant in kava. I know with certain conditions the GGT being high is a bad sign, but the problem is that we don't currently understand the full meaning of the GGT being elevated. We know some things, but studies are still being done. From what I've read, the concern should be when the AST and ALT are also elevated. Also I saw that exercise can contribute to elevated GGT. So it seems it's really hard to say whether this is a problem.

    I also use the lab analyzer and think it's a pretty cool and useful tool. I wish it told the whole story though of the meaning of all the results combined. Like it or not, this is where the people with the medical degree come in. Of course it depends on who you ask in the medical community, but my doctors do not seem concerned about my results-both my primary care doctor and my hematologist and obgyn. My pcp wasn't happy with the cholesterol, but he told me to simply use more olive oil and eat less red meat.

    Your proposed kava break won't hurt you of course, and if you're very worried, you could always take some liver herbs like milkthistle. Milkthistle is very effective. I do wonder if the break is necessarry. You know your own body best and should do what you feel is right for you.
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  16. Krunkie McKrunkface

    Krunkie McKrunkface Kava Enthusiast

    as of yesterday, 10th of dec 18, first figure is my result, followed by the reference (range) ftr I drink 8 TBS grind/day, made into about 3L of grog, and have been drinking daily for the past 2 years.

    EXECUTIVE SUMMARY: we cool (edit: we cool as far as my liver goes)

    Albumin 4.3 GM/DL 3.5 - 5.0 GM/DL
    Total Bilirubin 0.4 MG/DL 0.2 - 1.3 MG/DL
    Alkaline Phosphatase 66 U/L 38 - 126 U/L
    AST 22 U/L 17 - 59 U/L
    ALT (SGPT) 26 U/L 21 - 72 U/L
    eGFR >60 mL/min/1.73 m2 >59 mL/min/1.73 m2
    If patient is African American, multiply eGFR by 1.210.
    Anion Gap 11.3 mmol/L 10 - 20 mmol/L
    Globulin 2.6 g/dL g/dL
    Albumin/Globulin Ratio 1.7 1.1 - 2.2
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2018
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  17. schatz

    schatz itchin for kava

    You might want to check out Chanka Piedra tea amazing stuff. I could bore you with my own stories of kidney stones, but you might find it interesting. It also works on Gallstones.
  18. Krunkie McKrunkface

    Krunkie McKrunkface Kava Enthusiast

    as of two days ago, all good. Note that I am now on a powerful drug, abiraterone acetate along with prednisone to stabilise adrenal function, which is potentially hepatoxic so I will be having my levels done every two weeks for the next couple of years:

    Albumin 4.2 GM/DL 3.5 - 5.0 GM/DL
    Total Bilirubin 0.4 MG/DL 0.2 - 1.3 MG/DL
    Alkaline Phosphatase 51 U/L 38 - 126 U/L
    AST 18 U/L 17 - 59 U/L
    ALT (SGPT) 21 U/L 21 - 72 U/L
    eGFR >60 mL/min/1.73 m2 >59 mL/min/1.73 m2
    If patient is African American, multiply eGFR by 1.210.
    Anion Gap 10.2 mmol/L 10 - 20 mmol/L
    Globulin 2.4 g/dL g/dL
    Albumin/Globulin Ratio 1.8 1.1 - 2.2
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
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  19. Krunkie McKrunkface

    Krunkie McKrunkface Kava Enthusiast

    as of 1/24/19 also note I take large daily doses of a chemotherapy drug known to be hepatotoxic. Still looks good.

    Glucose 128 mg/dL 65 - 140 mg/dL
    BUN, Bld 12 mg/dL 9 - 20 mg/dL
    Creatinine Serum 0.7 mg/dL 0.66 - 1.25 mg/dL
    Calcium 9.3 MG/DL 8.4 - 10.2 MG/DL
    Sodium 139 MMOL/L 137 - 145 MMOL/L
    Potassium 3.8 mmol/L 3.5 - 5.1 mmol/L
    Chloride 105 mmol/L 98 - 109 mmol/L
    CO2 28 mmol/L 22 - 30 mmol/L
    Protein, Total 6.3 g/dL 6.3 - 8.2 g/dL
    Albumin 4.0 GM/DL 3.5 - 5.0 GM/DL
    Total Bilirubin 0.5 MG/DL 0.2 - 1.3 MG/DL
    Alkaline Phosphatase 49 U/L 38 - 126 U/L
    AST 21 U/L 17 - 59 U/L
    ALT (SGPT) 32 U/L 21 - 72 U/L
    eGFR >60 mL/min/1.73 m2 >59 mL/min/1.73 m2
    If patient is African American, multiply eGFR by 1.210.
    Anion Gap 10.7 mmol/L 10 - 20 mmol/L
    Globulin 2.3 g/dL g/dL
    Albumin/Globulin Ratio 1.7 1.1 - 2.2
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  20. Krunkie McKrunkface

    Krunkie McKrunkface Kava Enthusiast

    BUN, Bld 12 mg/dL 9 - 20 mg/dL
    Creatinine Serum 0.7 mg/dL 0.66 - 1.25 mg/dL
    Calcium 9.1 MG/DL 8.4 - 10.2 MG/DL
    Sodium 140 MMOL/L 137 - 145 MMOL/L
    Potassium 3.6 mmol/L 3.5 - 5.1 mmol/L
    Chloride 107 mmol/L 98 - 109 mmol/L
    CO2 28 mmol/L 22 - 30 mmol/L
    Protein, Total 6.1 g/dL 6.3 - 8.2 g/dL
    Albumin 3.9 GM/DL 3.5 - 5.0 GM/DL
    Total Bilirubin 0.3 MG/DL 0.2 - 1.3 MG/DL
    Alkaline Phosphatase 52 U/L 38 - 126 U/L
    AST 21 U/L 17 - 59 U/L
    ALT (SGPT) 21 U/L 21 - 72 U/L
    eGFR >60 mL/min/1.73 m2 >59 mL/min/1.73 m2
    If patient is African American, multiply eGFR by 1.210.
    Anion Gap 9.1 mmol/L 10 - 20 mmol/L
    Globulin 2.2 g/dL g/dL
    Albumin/Globulin Ratio 1.8 1.1 - 2.2

    Still good to go after 4 weeks of chemo and radiation. Kava helping all along the way. I chug 500 mls grog in the half hour before radiation, for which I have to have a full bladder. I have a couple candies in my mouth while getting zapped. Then I go to work and drink grog, then go home and drink grog. Grog is good. But also, extracts and good concentrates and candies are good for when you have nausea and can't drink grog but you need kava. Actual life savers. Be grateful we have these available to us.
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