Hanging it up. Any alternatives?

[TrevC]

Hey guys! Well, after almost giving up on Kava and FINALLY realizing it just takes higher doses to affect me, I started getting dry skin, which turned into cracky skin. I took a short break and, when I started back, totally avoided using one particular strain that was mentioned as a possible culprit. The dry skin came back almost immediately, and not only on my hands, but lightly on my face. I'm using Amlactin, as recommended, but am not keen on the idea of continually ingesting stuff that will gradually turn me into a lizard person.

As I've been using Kava to taper away from K@, I'm curious as to what else is out there. I found that, even preparing Kava, put me in an elevated mood. I feel similarly when I'm measuring out my doses of Moringa Leaf, Maca, Ashwagandha, Mucuna, Bacopa, etc. But apart from general nutritional health, the more profound mood-altering aspects of K@ and Kava have benefited me greatly. I just regret that K@ forms bodily-dependence. Even if you don't feel like you need it one day, after taking it daily for a while, your body will let you know otherwise when you try to go to sleep. I've never done any hard drugs, but I've read withdrawals from them are terrible. Still, K@ withdrawals aren't exactly a walk in the park. That's why I was SO dang excited about Kava: no bodily dependence.

And I'm not an alcohol person. So I'm not sure what else is out there in terms of more natural anxiolytic products. Any help would be appreciated!

 

[Zac Imiola (Herbalist)]

Lots of stuff !
Kava is on the more potent side obviously but get yourself some skullcap, hops, possibly valerian root, blue vervain, catnip yes catnip, and or passion flower... all in fresh tincture form.. they will do wonders for you. If one doesn't work try another and if two work combine them

 

[ThePiper]

California poppy makes for a good tincture. Kind of like kava or alcohol but more subtle yet very pleasant. Lotus flower stamen whole or extract is nice too. It only seems to work when you space its use out like once a week tops. A nice lucid floaty feeling with the same positive outlook that kava brings only less body effect.

Magnolia biphenols are fairly inexpensive and potent and are good for anxiety and sleep.

 

[TrevC]

Excellent suggestions! I am familiar with Valerian and California Poppy (which, this tincture I have was apparently made with vodka), but those others are new to me. I’ll check into them!

Kanna and Akuamma were the other things I tried, with no effect.

 

[recentreturn]

Lots of stuff !
...catnip yes catnip...

Ha, I got a massive pile of that stuff dried out on my dresser; I need to find a way to store. Makes great tea, though.

 

[recentreturn]

Hey guys! Well, after almost giving up on Kava and FINALLY realizing it just takes higher doses to affect me, I started getting dry skin, which turned into cracky skin. I took a short break and, when I started back, totally avoided using one particular strain that was mentioned as a possible culprit. The dry skin came back almost immediately, and not only on my hands, but lightly on my face. I'm using Amlactin, as recommended, but am not keen on the idea of continually ingesting stuff that will gradually turn me into a lizard person.

As I've been using Kava to taper away from K@, I'm curious as to what else is out there. I found that, even preparing Kava, put me in an elevated mood. I feel similarly when I'm measuring out my doses of Moringa Leaf, Maca, Ashwagandha, Mucuna, Bacopa, etc. But apart from general nutritional health, the more profound mood-altering aspects of K@ and Kava have benefited me greatly. I just regret that K@ forms bodily-dependence. Even if you don't feel like you need it one day, after taking it daily for a while, your body will let you know otherwise when you try to go to sleep. I've never done any hard drugs, but I've read withdrawals from them are terrible. Still, K@ withdrawals aren't exactly a walk in the park. That's why I was SO dang excited about Kava: no bodily dependence.

And I'm not an alcohol person. So I'm not sure what else is out there in terms of more natural anxiolytic products. Any help would be appreciated!

Not a product, but I think jogging is one of the best anxiolytics out there; seriously.
Re: dermo, just cause you got some dermo doesn't mean you are condemned to it. It can take a few weeks to run its course and usually continues to worsen after you strop drinking kava. Once it has run its course (or on the tail end), you could experiment with reintroducing kava.

 

[Krunkie McKrunkface]

Not a product, but I think jogging is one of the best anxiolytics out there; seriously.
Re: dermo, just cause you got some dermo doesn't mean you are condemned to it. It can take a few weeks to run its course and usually continues to worsen after you strop drinking kava. Once it has run its course (or on the tail end), you could experiment with reintroducing kava.

yes, many people when they start drinking kava go through an initial phase where they are susceptible to dermo and then it just goes away. In my own case, I got dermo occasionally for the first few months then it stopped. I do try to avoid contact with the solid sediments of grind. No problem with the good silky stuff, but the lumber I avoid.

 

[Zac Imiola (Herbalist)]

Avoid legal high websites and buy from mountain rose herbs or herb pharm.
Catnip has to be fresh or recently dried
Same with all others .
Magnolia bark is good too as you mentioned. Called happiness tree bark.
You could also try st Johns wort fresh tincture unless your already over stimulated visually with anxiety.
Blue lotus is good to I agree.

I really really recommend skullcap fresh tincture that stuff is amazingly potent and yet subtle

 

[Groggy]

There's a cost/benefit to everything, kava included. From my personal experience, nothing beats kava. Dermo is a small price to pay and your body does get adjusted overtime.

 

[TrevC]

Great mix of feedback, guys. Thank you. Being new to it, I was alarmed at what my skin started doing. I am willing to experiment a little more and see what happens. It just really alarmed me when I saw the skin on my face looking ashy. :/

When purchasing kava root, I also bought some Kava Candy. I know it's made from extract. In you all's experience/knowledge, would it still be possible for the candy form to cause skin issues to flare up? I never figured out my dosage on those (two at a time had no noticeable effect), but would like to try again.

 

[Pauluk]

I woukd like to suggest L theanine.
Its an amino acid. Best to use the sunthenine brand to start with. Not as expensive as kava. I found it quite good for anxiety. However I never took it in high doses. Maybe it could be very good. Certainly not placebo. Panic disorder sufferers would love a placebo to work.

 

[Krunkie McKrunkface]

Great mix of feedback, guys. Thank you. Being new to it, I was alarmed at what my skin started doing. I am willing to experiment a little more and see what happens. It just really alarmed me when I saw the skin on my face looking ashy. :/

When purchasing kava root, I also bought some Kava Candy. I know it's made from extract. In you all's experience/knowledge, would it still be possible for the candy form to cause skin issues to flare up? I never figured out my dosage on those (two at a time had no noticeable effect), but would like to try again.

the problem here is that no one knows for sure how kava dermopathy works, why some get it and others don't, or why some get it worse than others or more or less frequently or if the body simply adapts or what. No one knows.

If, as I suspect, Kapmcrunk is right and it is a kind of allergic reaction (by no means a typical allergic reaction, but a relatively rarish kind) then at least that explains the variability, and to some extent how one can adapt or desensitize one's response to whatever allergen is involved. I also, like others, suspect that substance that triggers dermo is found in the makas and is more pronounced in lawena than waka. And it seems you can chew on the dried roots and not get dermo so it would seem to me it is something hat happens in the stomach as opposed to in the mouth or nose or wherever, possibly as part of the digestion process, possibly a process in which an ingredient is transformed. People who toss and wash both a lot and regularly seem to inevitably get dermo, so it seems some of the severity could be tied to the amount of the makas that gets to the stomach. Even a small amount can trigger dermo, but it could be very mild. (and as suggested by music videos, it may occur more with fresh kava than with dried medium grind, perhaps that would have to do with the maturity of the allergen relating to potency of allergic reaction provoked? Just complete speculation here on my part)

Fwiw I advocate a broad spectrum definition of kava dermopathy so the symptom list includes everything that could be part of it, like kava skin kava skin girl I got that kava skin, of course, but also sties, kava fairy dust in your panties, tight painful burning cracking thin skin, old man hands.