Placebo effect

[Snypavat]

Last week I was delivered some Puoni Ono from KWK. 1 lb to be exact. I consumed roughly 3/4 of that pound since Monday in 5 sessions.

I found the most appealing way to prep for me was about 1/2 of a cup to 2 cups of Welch's Pinapple Orange juice, strained with the WAKACON filter bag- chased with a slice of ginger.

I thought I felt some effects but after reading more experiences on here, I think I am experiencing a placebo effect. I slept well but haven't felt any effects similar to alcohol, no mood change, no loopy effect. I felt slightly relaxed however.

I ended up drinking on Friday and Saturday instead of doing a Kava session because my apparent placebo was nothing compared to a good beer buzz. Had an awesome drum session however!

I have some Fiji Loa Waka (1lb) being delivered today. Hopefully I get something out of it this time!

 

[verticity]

Last week I was delivered some Puoni Ono from KWK. 1 lb to be exact. I consumed roughly 3/4 of that pound since Monday in 5 sessions.

I found the most appealing way to prep for me was about 1/2 of a cup to 2 cups of Welch's Pinapple Orange juice, strained with the WAKACON filter bag- chased with a slice of ginger.

I thought I felt some effects but after reading more experiences on here, I think I am experiencing a placebo effect. I slept well but haven't felt any effects similar to alcohol, no mood change, no loopy effect. I felt slightly relaxed however.

I ended up drinking on Friday and Saturday instead of doing a Kava session because my apparent placebo was nothing compared to a good beer buzz. Had an awesome drum session however!

I have some Fiji Loa Waka (1lb) being delivered today. Hopefully I get something out of it this time!

How are you preparing it exactly? Are you kneading the powder in the bag?
One thing to note is that if you use orange juice, the ascorbic acid can destroy some of the kavain (aka the good stuff).
I would recommend just kneading in plain hot (but not boiling) water for about 10 minutes for maximum potency, then add some ice cubes or put in the refrigerator to chill. Also for 1/2 cup of root, you could use about 4 cups of water. If the taste is really intolerable to you, you can add a teaspoon or two of Crystal Light Lemonade mix (it contains citric acid, but no ascorbic acid).

 

[Snypavat]

How are you preparing it exactly? Are you kneading the powder in the bag?
One thing to note is that if you use orange juice, the ascorbic acid can destroy some of the kavain (aka the good stuff).
I would recommend just kneading in plain hot (but not boiling) water for about 10 minutes for maximum potency, then add some ice cubes or put in the refrigerator to chill. Also for 1/2 cup of root, you could use about 4 cups of water. If the taste is really intolerable to you, you can add a teaspoon or two of Crystal Light Lemonade mix (it contains citric acid, but no ascorbic acid).

I use cold Pinapple/Orange juice and knead the bag in that juice for roughly ten minutes. I will try your method tonight and see how I do. Also, How much do you drink per shell and in one session, how far apart between shells?

 

[Deleted User01]

@Snypavat, the "effects" of kava are mild compared to alcohol but there is no hangover. When you really want to party down you can still have your periodic beer session but don't mix it with kava. Kava keeps me and others from drinking every day. I actually get a better nights sleep with kava because alcohol can cause a little restlessness during sleep. But you are right, Kava does not give the same buzz as alcohol.

 

[Snypavat]

I use cold Pinapple/Orange juice and knead the bag in that juice for roughly ten minutes. I will try your method tonight and see how I do.

That's mainly the thing. I can enjoy my nights on the weekend with beer but the next day I feel absolutely awful now that I'm getting older. I don't deal well at all with a lack of sleep.

 

[Kojo Douglas]

If you go into a Kava session expecting alcohol-like effects, you are going to be disappointed.

 

[Snypavat]

If you go into a Kava session expecting alcohol-like effects, you are going to be disappointed.

I'm not sure what I should actually be expecting. LOL. Its my only point of reference.

 

[Kojo Douglas]

I'm not sure what I should actually be expecting. LOL. Its my only point of reference.

The effects of Kava are fundamentally different from those of alcohol. It is a subtle, dreamy, and mild medicine that you need to set time aside for and focus on (we call it "listening to the Kava.") If you drink Kava with friends, you might find yourself lounging around, telling stories, and laughing for hours.

If you have anxiety issues and drink Kava, you are more likely to feel it immediately. It has strong anti-anxiety properties and will make you feel less worried, more relaxed, and more focused.

 

[FYS]

I've just started in delve into the deeper side of kava so I'm not 100% sure of its effect on kavalactones but it may be that inducing a proteolytic environment with the proteases found in pineapple, namely bromelain, may be resulting in catabolism of the kavalactones by hydrolysis.

IMO it seems unlikely but, again, I haven't gotten too deep into kavalactones yet and I felt it was worth mentioning. Perhaps try it without the pineapple and see if you have better results.

 

[Edward]

@Snypavat I was a heavy drinker for years before I started drinking kava and it took a long period of readjustment until I got to the point that I no longer craved alcohol. If you want more of an "out of it" feeling then go for a beer but if you want to feel "at one" with the world, calm and relaxed with no hangover the next morning then kava is the one. You can mix and match (given enough time between each) but I found that after enough time of drinking kava I no longer even wanted to drink alcohol. Everyone is different and some people no doubt prefer a stronger relaxing effect in the evenings than a good kava feeling can give you but I urge you to keep trying because overall and in the long term kava will be better for you.

 

[Snypavat]

Thank you to everyone for your replies!

I tried a different methods tonight with the Loa Waka. Bam! I broke through the wall of RT!
1/2 CUP of root to 2 cups of warm milk. I feel excellent! A little loopy but clear headed and calm. Amazing feeling to be honest with some slight ringing in my ears.
Thank you for all of your advice! I can see this as being a good alcohol replacement.

An additional quick question. I've been having some moderate back pain for the past few days, ironically since I've started kava. Is it OK to take two Ibuprofen during a session or will this cause liver issues?

Update: Nevermind! All pain has subsided, but the nausea even with the ginger slices is still uncomfortable!

 

[verticity]

I use cold Pinapple/Orange juice and knead the bag in that juice for roughly ten minutes. I will try your method tonight and see how I do. Also, How much do you drink per shell and in one session, how far apart between shells?

If I make it with 4 cups of water, I drink 1 cup every half hour or so, for a total of 4 1-cup "shells". Sometimes I actually make it more dilute, so drink a correspondingly higher amount of liquid per "shell".

 

[verticity]

Thank you to everyone for your replies!

I tried a different methods tonight with the Loa Waka. Bam! I broke through the wall of RT!
1/2 CUP of root to 2 cups of warm milk. I feel excellent! A little loopy but clear headed and calm. Amazing feeling to be honest with some slight ringing in my ears.
Thank you for all of your advice! I can see this as being a good alcohol replacement.

An additional quick question. I've been having some moderate back pain for the past few days, ironically since I've started kava. Is it OK to take two Ibuprofen during a session or will this cause liver issues?

Update: Nevermind! All pain has subsided, but the nausea even with the ginger slices is still uncomfortable!

Great, glad it worked for you.
Some things you can do to help the nausea are:
- Make the kava more dilute
- Use a finer strainer (I use 80 micron nut milk bags that Cactus Kava sends with each order).
- Drink smaller shells, spaced farther apart
- Loa Waka is a really strong kava. You could try using less powder.
- Make sure to chill the kava before you drink it; you can just toss in some ice cubes to chill it quickly. Warm kava is more nauseating for some people.
- Try water instead of milk..

 

[verticity]

An additional quick question. I've been having some moderate back pain for the past few days, ironically since I've started kava. Is it OK to take two Ibuprofen during a session or will this cause liver issues?

It is not recommended to take Ibuprofen or acetaminophen/Tylenol with kava. (Especially not Tylenol) However, plain old aspirin is fine, because aspirin is metabolized by a different pathway in the liver.
To put things in perspective Ibuprofen/Tylenol + alcohol is probably a more dangerous combination than Ibuprofen/Tylenol + kava. But best to err on the side of caution.

 

[Snypavat]

Great, glad it worked for you.
Some things you can do to help the nausea are:
- Make the kava more dilute
- Use a finer strainer (I use 80 micron nut milk bags that Cactus Kava sends with each order).
- Drink smaller shells, spaced farther apart
- Loa Waka is a really strong kava. You could try using less powder.
- Make sure to chill the kava before you drink it; you can just toss in some ice cubes to chill it quickly. Warm kava is more nauseating for some people.
- Try water instead of milk..

I am going to try a finer strainer today (does anyone know the micron count on the WAKACON filter bags? Can't seem to find that info anywhere) I do worry that filtering it too much will dull the effects. Is this not the case?

 

[verticity]

I am going to try a finer strainer today (does anyone know the micron count on the WAKACON filter bags? Can't seem to find that info anywhere) I do worry that filtering it too much will dull the effects. Is this not the case?

I don't see any information about that on Amazon, but the picture does look like like a decent strainer. You could try asking the company.
It is true that the finer your filter, the less potent your drink will be, so it's kind of a balancing act of finding the right filter that doesn't let too much sediment through, but still creates a potent drink. I find 80 microns about right. The Wakacon bag might well be 80 microns, and you may just need to use more liquid and less powder to prevent nausea. However it might be 300 microns, which is another common size, which is too big in my opinion. You would have to ask them.

 

[Moondo57]

To be honest you might need to make sure that you have a super empty stomach! That makes all of the difference for me in terms of effects. Also, whereas alcohol would cause you to lose interest in things and focus more on how you "feel" or "spin" lol, kava will cause you to find this "inner joy" in doing things and interacting with the world around you. For instance, I had a powerful experience last week which caused me to sharpen my knives and rummage around in my closet and just have a BLAST doing it. Or it will spur me on to go on a walk outside and just look at the sky and think about how wonderful the day is and how great everything is! Hope that helps with the expectations that you have regarding this wonderful root!

 

[Kojo Douglas]

If I remember correctly, the Wakacon strainer was this kind of thick felt stuff. Kind of weird, if you ask me. @LunaKava sells some amazing Kava strainers!

 

[Dan More]

I just got the the Wakacon strainer a couple days ago and it was a big, strong, white nylon bag with a drawstring. It did COME in a thick felt-like bag with the Wakacon logo. Is it possible they left out the strainer for your order and you used the carry bag? Funny!