Eye Irritation

[kavalover]

Does anyone else get mildly irritated (feel very dry) and slightly bloodshot eyes after prolonged kava use? I hear this is, along with the kava rash, is fairly common in those who drink *too* much kava for a bit too long. I typically see this as the point to go a few days/weeks with no kava to let myself adjust.

Was just wondering if any of you guys have experienced it?

(smiley: eek)

 

[kavalover]

I take it nobody experienced this, or at least not yet. Am suffering from the eye irritation again It's only mildly irritating but enough to notice throughout the day.

 

[Vekta]

Hmmm....



no not that I can remember.

 

[kl.Gray Owl]

Maybe try Systane moisturizing eyedrops, those are pretty good although a bit expensive, they are drug free so you can't use too much.

 

[kl.Gray Owl]

I've had to cut back on my consumption because my eyes were itchy and red and I think it was causing my psoriasis to act up, both have improved since I cut back. The rash was the usual psoriasis patches that I get with tiny blisters filled with clear fluid on my ankles, so I think it's different from what I've read about kava icthyosis. From what I was reading about kava rash, typically that comes with like 900 g of kava per week or more. At the peak I was probably around the equivalent of about 400 g but that's guesstimating with respect to instant kava. I think 18 g (6 tsp) of instant is roughly equivalent to about 60 g of powdered root since both give me about 6 shells of kava. I think some of the substances in kava or their metabolites may tend to bind to cells and induce an immune reaction, but that is just a theory.

 

[Prince Philip]

I use a drug called clemastine, recommended by my Royal Apothecary. It was one of the two active ingredients in Tavist D, before it was pulled off the market for slightly killing people. Clemastine is the safer of the two, and is available from Walgreen's as "Wal-hist," in the sky blue box.



(Phenylpropanolamine did the actual killing, clemastine was just along for the ride).



I find that the best thing for the eye irritation is sleep. I prefer to have at least a bit of kava dermopathy at all times to prove to myself that I'm doing it right. Of course, at age 90 it is difficult at times to figure out what's dermopathy and what's just being 90. (June 10th, I'll be 91. Celebrations to occur at Buckingham Palace and various locations around Tanna. Everyone invited - Wal-Hist a welcomed gift)!

 

[kavalover]

Grayowl, your theory sounds likely cause for kava dermopathy. I would like to research this more, if you ever find anything on this let me know.



Thanks Prince Philip, I'll give that stuff a shot. My condition was most definitely kava dermopathy as now after 2 weeks of no kava-use I have none of the symptoms. I'll do my best to document the effects of it myself, just as a little documented track record of this condition in my personal use.

 

[kl.Gray Owl]

I use a drug called clemastine, recommended by my Royal Apothecary. It was one of the two active ingredients in Tavist D, before it was pulled off the market for slightly killing people. Clemastine is the safer of the two, and is available from Walgreen's as "Wal-hist," in the sky blue box.



(Phenylpropanolamine did the actual killing, clemastine was just along for the ride).



I find that the best thing for the eye irritation is sleep. I prefer to have at least a bit of kava dermopathy at all times to prove to myself that I'm doing it right. Of course, at age 90 it is difficult at times to figure out what's dermopathy and what's just being 90. (June 10th, I'll be 91. Celebrations to occur at Buckingham Palace and various locations around Tanna. Everyone invited - Wal-Hist a welcomed gift)!

Thank you, your highness.  I made the pilgrimage to Walgreens and the Wal-Hist is helping and cheaper than Tavist.  I actually started taking Tavist in grade school, my allergies were that bad, of course it knocked me out then.  But I've taken so much antihistamines over a lifetime that even Benadryl hardly makes me drowsy anymore.

 

[kavalover]

I've been reading "kava: The Pacific Elixir" by Vincent Lebot, Mark Merlin and Lamont Lindstrom. Awesome read, I think every kava drinker should get their hands on this one and give it a read. I think actually, was it you grayowl who recommended it? Vekta? I can't remember. Anyway, I stumbled upon this passage I'd like to share with you guys.

Kava drinkers are thus sometimes recognizable by their bloodshot eyes and ulcerous skin. These symptoms occasionally are wrongly diagnosed as ichtyosarcotoxism, or ciguatera (fish poisoning), which is an occasional health problem in the South Pacific. Such reactions are only found in heavy drinkers and can be attributed to the properties of kava's active constituents, lactones. The lactones in kava are related to sesquiterpenical lactones - "allergens capable of causing severe eczemas... what provokes the aggressiveness of these substances is the presence of an alpha-methylene-butyrolactone group which enables them to attach themselves to the skin proteins thus easily forming complete antigens, which are responsible for the series of biological reactions, which finally lead to the state of allergy" (Benezra and Dupuis 1983). Skin lesions, called kani kani in Fiji (Frater 1952), disappear if kava consumption is reduced. Kani kani seems to affect only those drinkers susceptible to the allergens.

"Kava: The Pacific Elixir" p60

Loads of information that has answered many questions I see on these boards. Really it's a great deal look for it on Amazon (smiley: tongue)

 

[kl.Gray Owl]

I read something lately about citrus bioflavanoids helping with tinnitus by inhibiting histamine, so I'm trying a quercetin supplement. I think it might also help with the eye and skin irritation from kava, which I have read may be due to the flavanoid glycosides contained in kava binding to epithelial cells.

 

[ObiWan]

no problems with my eyes yet, but daily kava drinking causes a dry throat and dry nose for me.

The skin of my right hand (which I use for squeezing the Kava) also got very dry after a few months. Now I use a lotex glove

 

[kl.CarolinaBC]

I get dry skin on my squeezing hand and occasional scratchy/red eyes from kava too.

 

[kl.Letharia]

I've often felt as if my eyes had glue in them while drinking Kava... I've only been drinking it for a few weeks though, so I guess symptoms could show up any time, probably depending on your particular sensitivities. I actually thought my allergies were acting up at first, but haven't felt that way until Kava came along.

 

[kl.KarmaG]

No eye irritation, but I have noticed some itchy skin around my jawline recently. Could be coincidence though since I get dry skin often, just not usually there.

 

[The Kap'n]

I completely understand the dryness. I've had full on kava dermopathy when I was drinking tudei kava powder mixed with water, no straining. The skin on my back was cracked and bleeding in a leopard pattern. It was indeed quite miserable and I don't recommend it. I started straining the kava, using a more "noble" (less DHK) type, and eating vitamins and my skin has mostly returned to normal. I can always tell a good kava by its' astringent quality about 15 minutes in when my eyes feel dry and my skin feels like a desert. Do you wear contacts? I noticed kava consumption does a number on your eyes especially if you wear contacts.

 

[Slow Native]

Feel like I've been in a chlorinated pool all day.. Very similar through the next day, interesting

 

[Ozzyfan121]

I'm not certain if it's the same feeling or cause, but nearly every time I drink kava my eyes feel dry and my vision is blurry until a few hours after I've ceased consumption or I go to bed. It's definitely annoying. Unlike Grey Owl, who makes me feel ashamed to even express an interest in pharmacology—how do you even get that knowledgable?!—, I don't have any recommendations other than staying hydrated and using eye drops frequently.

 

[kl.NDG]

The dermopathy is likely a result of mast cell degranulation. Mast cells are these little fucks that float around in your body and have a bunch of inflammatory mediators inside them. When they are prompted to break open, ie degranulate histamine (leukotrines etc) are released, this would explain why diphenhydramine works so well. I could think of some natural prophylactics to this if anyone cares.



I think I have a bit of it going on in the flexor surfaces of my arms. I also get the dry eyes, like ive been looking into a fan for hours on end.

 

[kl.Modernaught]

I care. Advise this prophylactic knowledge please.

 

[kavalover]

I care as well.



I actually haven't had much issue with this allergy as when I first started this thread. It used to get bad, but now, not so much. The only difference in this time span has been the amount of kava I've drank, which has actually increased.