I'm preparing to sell carbonated kava

[TheKavaSociety]

As a student of biology and chemistry, I'm going to guess it's timing. If you seal it right away, no air, no leaks, there was no bacteria to begin with. We're talking about no additives, so that means no preservatives. Heat acts funny when you bottle it up. I bet it's done cold, and if sealed right away, has no chance or opportunity to grow bacteria until air is let in.

What do you mean no bacteria to begin with? Kava powder is not sterile.
Kava has neutral pH, so when you add water and have it at room temp to,it's a party for the microbes.

 

[Aloha Kava]

Interesting!
Did they know what kava was or did you just tell them it was like tea?

I'd say you might still find it challenging to actually make it shelf stable, unless you want to use preservatives.

No, I let them know the whole deal! They had to call me back after a couple days of looking into it hah, I had to send them several links.

Regarding shelf stability, I've bottled and set it on my shelf in pretty warm weather for various lengths of time, and they all came out fine. Although it isn't beer and of course ethanol helps stop bacterial growth, beer can still have terrible problems if bottled incorrectly. What makes it work is careful sanitization, purging bottles of oxygen, and foam-capping with oxygen absorbing caps. I also use lactic acid, a natural preservative, for good measure. I'm always working on perfecting this front since it's so important.

Are you currently selling? Contact me, I'm ready to place an order.

I'll pay the shipping, I want to try your product.

I'm getting bottles in soon and will let you know when I'm ready to go!

 

[kavakarma]

You are correct Henry, good point. I mean if it is sealed it should be stable. Looks as though vacuum sealing is the process? Tell me if vacuum sealing is not enough."Foam capping" is a new term to me.

 

[Alia]

No, I let them know the whole deal! They had to call me back after a couple days of looking into it hah, I had to send them several links.





I'm getting bottles in soon and will let you know when I'm ready to go!

This is wonderful news...when you sent FDA links did they reply in writing? If you ever get FDA confirmation*in writing then please share.
This would be a game-changer
The basic question-- can kava be processed in a Certified Kitchen style environment as a "food/beverage" OR
does kava processing require the more complex Dietary Supplement style processing environment, which is
considerably beyond a Certified Kitchen.

 

[verticity]

This product sounds interesting. I can definitely imagine how carbonation could improve the flavor of kava for people who are not too fond of that "earthiness."

Pacific Roots Kava (Henry & KWK) has been secretive about the exact method they use to make their kava shelf stable, but they do clearly state that the method does not involve any preservatives. That leaves pasteurization methods involving either heat or pressure as what they must be using. I am skeptical that just adding a little lactic acid would work. I'm not a beverage bottling expert or anything, and maybe I'm wrong, but I would guess that the challenge of making shelf-stable kava would be more similar to juice or milk than to beer, since you don't have any alcohol acting as a natural preservative.

 

[Aloha Kava]

This is wonderful news...when you sent FDA links did they reply in writing? If you ever get FDA confirmation*in writing then please share.
This would be a game-changer
The basic question-- can kava be processed in a Certified Kitchen style environment as a "food/beverage" OR
does kava processing require the more complex Dietary Supplement style processing environment, which is
considerably beyond a Certified Kitchen.

I can only speak from what I've learned from the FDA and health departments on my end. I'm a total newbie with this however, and the titans of the kava market use this forum so I am sure they know more than me. In any case, that'll be on me if additional requirements come hammering down. My method is the same as beer bottlers: sanitize bottles, purge the oxygen, fill to the brim with foam and cap with oxygen absorbing caps to protect flavor and against bacterial growth (along with a very small amount of lactic acid to further discourage bacteria).

Anyway like I said, I'm a newbie. Just testing the waters!

 

[TheKavaSociety]

This product sounds interesting. I can definitely imagine how carbonation could improve the flavor of kava for people who are not too fond of that "earthiness."

Pacific Roots Kava (Henry & KWK) has been secretive about the exact method they use to make their kava shelf stable, but they do clearly state that the method does not involve any preservatives. That leaves pasteurization methods involving either heat or pressure as what they must be using. I am skeptical that just adding a little lactic acid would work. I'm not a beverage bottling expert or anything, and maybe I'm wrong, but I would guess that the challenge of making shelf-stable kava would be more similar to juice or milk than to beer, since you don't have any alcohol acting as a natural preservative.

We've experimented with several methods, including some really cutting edge stuff. Eventually we've chosen two methods that appear to produce the best results and make the product as close to raw/untreated as possible. Mike preferred one of those methods for the US market, I personally prefer the other one, especially after I've managed to massively improve it a few months ago. Not sure which method (if any) might be used in future production in light of Mike's passing. It is possible that the project might need to be shelved.

 

[TheKavaSociety]

I can only speak from what I've learned from the FDA and health departments on my end. I'm a total newbie with this however, and the titans of the kava market use this forum so I am sure they know more than me. In any case, that'll be on me if additional requirements come hammering down. My method is the same as beer bottlers: sanitize bottles, purge the oxygen, fill to the brim with foam and cap with oxygen absorbing caps to protect flavor and against bacterial growth (along with a very small amount of lactic acid to further discourage bacteria).

Anyway like I said, I'm a newbie. Just testing the waters!

As someone who has spent a considerable amount of time developing a bottled, shelf stable kava beverage, I can say it's a pretty difficult journey. I don't want you to be discouraged, but I just want to point out a few basic issues: If you want to achieve a reasonable shelf life and have a consistently safe product, you must find a way to either make it sterile, or create an environment that doesn't support any microbial growth. Perhaps lactic acid could help you to achieve the latter (at least to a degree), but I imagine that any claims to extended shelf-life (especially at ambient temperature) would need to be backed up by some actual data and/or validation studies. It definetely can't be just "I left it on the counter for a week and it smelled fine". A lot of the very nasty microbes do not smell or taste funky, but may still cause serious health problems. It is entirely possible that a food product may become unsafe for consumption before it becomes unpalatable.

 

[bestfijikava.com]

I think it's a good idea. I would worry about shelf life, marketing, and distribution which will be one of your biggest hurdles but other then that its all fair game and I would love to see these in your local 7 elevens

 

[Alia]

This product sounds interesting. I can definitely imagine how carbonation could improve the flavor of kava for people who are not too fond of that "earthiness."

Pacific Roots Kava (Henry & KWK) has been secretive about the exact method they use to make their kava shelf stable, but they do clearly state that the method does not involve any preservatives. That leaves pasteurization methods involving either heat or pressure as what they must be using. I am skeptical that just adding a little lactic acid would work. I'm not a beverage bottling expert or anything, and maybe I'm wrong, but I would guess that the challenge of making shelf-stable kava would be more similar to juice or milk than to beer, since you don't have any alcohol acting as a natural preservative.

I wonder if (somehow) a UV light could be used to clear pathogens, etc. My water Well post-filter has a UV light that supposedly does this.

 

[The Kap'n]

I wonder if (somehow) a UV light could be used to clear pathogens, etc. My water Well post-filter has a UV light that supposedly does this.

Root of Happiness uses a UV sterilizer to deal with batches that may not meet bacteriological standards. It looks kinda like a commercial pizza oven where you lay the kava out on a rack and it pulls it through slowly while exposing the powder to UV light.

 

[verticity]

I wonder if (somehow) a UV light could be used to clear pathogens, etc. My water Well post-filter has a UV light that supposedly does this.

Apparently, yes.

UV for Food and Beverage | American Ultraviolet

Food and Beverage ultraviolet germicidal fixtures from American Ultraviolet. Call 765-483-9514 today.

www.americanultraviolet.com

Another exotic method is ionizing radiation (gamma rays from radioactive isotopes or high-energy electron beams) I know radiation is used for things like meat..

Food irradiation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

This could be useful.. "Custom UVC tunnels are designed to treat bottles used as beverage containers in order to increase product shelf life, and reduce contamination. "

Custom Solutions for Food & Beverage Industry | American Ultraviolet

Custom Solutions for Food & Beverage Industry from American Ultraviolet. Please call 765-483-9514 today.

www.americanultraviolet.com

 

[The Kap'n]

Apparently, yes.

UV for Food and Beverage | American Ultraviolet

Food and Beverage ultraviolet germicidal fixtures from American Ultraviolet. Call 765-483-9514 today.

www.americanultraviolet.com

Another exotic method is ionizing radiation (gamma rays from radioactive isotopes or high-energy electron beams) I know radiation is used for things like meat..

Food irradiation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

This could be useful.. "Custom UVC tunnels are designed to treat bottles used as beverage containers in order to increase product shelf life, and reduce contamination. "

Custom Solutions for Food & Beverage Industry | American Ultraviolet

Custom Solutions for Food & Beverage Industry from American Ultraviolet. Please call 765-483-9514 today.

www.americanultraviolet.com

I hear if you crawl into one of those gamma sterilizers you'll glow for the rest of your life.

Albeit your life only lasting another few hours at most.

 

[TheKavaSociety]

Uv works well on clear water or very fine particles that get good exposure. However, you can't shine UV lamp at a bottle of milk (or even pour it through a tunnel) and hope it is now sterile.

 

[nabanga]

UV works well on clear water or very fine particles that get good exposure. However, you can't shine UV lamp at a bottle of milk (or even pour it through a tunnel) and hope it is now sterile.

True indeed - you also need to purchase the correct size unit for the application. Here in Laos bottled water suppliers pick up a $300 household UV unit designed for 500liters/day, then put 50,000liters/day through it for their bottled water plant, and proudly print on their bottles "sterilized with latest UV tech".

 

[Michael Nielsen]

What About high pressure processing?

 

[Kavaguy]

Reading this thread makes me want to buy one of these and see if carbonating my own kava makes it less of an unpleasant experience to drink...

Amazon product

 

[Aloha Kava]

Hey everyone,

So I'm ordering some bottles and once they're in, I'd like to send out some free "Aloha Kava" to whoever wants as both a product test and a fun kava community thing (also I suppose a test for if the quality survives shipping). Not sure exactly how this forum works yet (if I should make another post or post here again, etc), but anyway, that's the plan: two free bottles for up to 12 people. All free, shipped free.

 

[Zaphod]

I hear if you crawl into one of those gamma sterilizers you'll glow for the rest of your life.

Albeit your life only lasting another few hours at most.

would like to have a word with you....

 

[PurimGrogger]

Hey everyone,

So I'm ordering some bottles and once they're in, I'd like to send out some free "Aloha Kava" to whoever wants as both a product test and a fun kava community thing (also I suppose a test for if the quality survives shipping). Not sure exactly how this forum works yet (if I should make another post or post here again, etc), but anyway, that's the plan: two free bottles for up to 12 people. All free, shipped free.

Count me in