What's new

Reverse Tolerance (am I doing this wrong?)

Redrider

Kava Curious
So I've been drinking 2 shells every morning, as that's the easiest time to insure that I will be on an empty stomach. It's been a couple of weeks now, and I haven't felt anything yet - though I desperately want to.
Am I doing something wrong ?
1. Should I be drinking more ?
2. Should I be drinking at a different time of day ?
3. Is it wrong to switch strains/varieties each day ?
4. Am I just being too impatient ?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

P.S. Ilove this forum. Thank you all. You folks have been enormously helpful in the months I've been lurking.
 

Blinkyrocket

Kava Enthusiast
Idk, I'd say that you have to wait until the Kava "speaks to you.", and, while that's not typically the type of answer I would find acceptable, I think there's some truth to it. One thing I can say is to look for effects, from Kava, that you don't necessarily expect. Muscle relaxation, depressed respiration etc. If you don't have these effects, then you can truly say that Kava is not working at all right now. In other words, don't just look for a buzz; try and find any other effect that can be attributed to Kava. If you've got everything but the buzz, idk what to tell you except, maybe, that you might not be efficiently absorbing the Kavalactones in your Kava, or you're not preparing the Kava well enough to get all the goodies out of it. If you've got none of these effects, try a much higher dose. How many tablespoons, and what kind/cultivar, of Kava are you having with each of these sessions? When I say what "kind" of Kava, I mean is it heady or heavy?
 

Redrider

Kava Curious
Thank for the response.
I've been using: Ambae's from kava time, Nambawan from Bula Kava House, and occasionally Mâlôlô from Cactus Kava. It's my understanding that this would be classified as heavy - though I may be mistaken.
In terms of preparation; I've been blending them in the Vitamix for a decent amount of time, and then pouring into a cheesecloth bag and wringing out.
I've generally used approximately two tablespoons per serving, and I've been drinking tea servings about 20 minutes apart.
I don't think that I've felt any of what you mentioned. I'd very much like for it to work, though.
 

Blinkyrocket

Kava Enthusiast
Thank for the response.
I've been using: Ambae's from kava time, Nambawan from Bula Kava House, and occasionally Mâlôlô from Cactus Kava. It's my understanding that this would be classified as heavy - though I may be mistaken.
In terms of preparation; I've been blending them in the Vitamix for a decent amount of time, and then pouring into a cheesecloth bag and wringing out.
I've generally used approximately two tablespoons per serving, and I've been drinking tea servings about 20 minutes apart.
I don't think that I've felt any of what you mentioned. I'd very much like for it to work, though.
Nambawan is pretty surprising since I've felt the full brunt of dizziness and double vision etc. From that one, not to mention a buzz like no other. I will say that I had at least 10 tablespoons on that occassion - I seriously underestimated Nambawan that time. I'd say just to try a monstrous dose, just like mine, in order to break through so to speak. If still nothing happens, there's definitely something strange going on. You might also want to prepare Kava traditionally by giving it a good, rigorous kneading in a nut milk/Kava strainer bag. If you've ordered from Cactus Kava, I'd hedge a bet that they've also sent you a free strainer bag.

Ambae's is a heavy Kava, which means you should feel sedation and muscle relaxation. Nambawan should be very heady; it should be euphoric, energizing, and give you a buzz. I'm not sure about the one from Cactus Kava, but I do know Cactus Kava has some really good Kava despite the low potency. If you want something from Cactus Kava's Kava, you'll need at least 8 level tablespoons, I think.
 
Last edited:

recentreturn

Kava Enthusiast
Thank for the response.
I've been using: Ambae's from kava time, Nambawan from Bula Kava House, and occasionally Mâlôlô from Cactus Kava. It's my understanding that this would be classified as heavy - though I may be mistaken.
In terms of preparation; I've been blending them in the Vitamix for a decent amount of time, and then pouring into a cheesecloth bag and wringing out.
I've generally used approximately two tablespoons per serving, and I've been drinking tea servings about 20 minutes apart.
I don't think that I've felt any of what you mentioned. I'd very much like for it to work, though.
So you are drinking 4 tbs in under a half hour each morning on an empty stomach? I'd normally suggest trying more, but it sounds like you are using some pretty potent root. You might try it in an afternoon when you can really just chill out and sit still. The subtler effects of kava can be missed if you are running around busy with stuff. But once you get through reverse tolerance, I have a hard time imagining not feeling 4 tbs of Ambae's.
I recently drank kava for the second time with someone who firmly claimed they felt absolutely nothing whatsoever from it the first time. I think I ended up having them drink 6-8 tbs of Kadavu in a relatively short time and they finally felt it. But it sounds like its different for everyone. But if you have work to do, I'd be pretty careful drink 8 tbs of a heavy kava in the morning, in case it kick in. If I drank even 4 tbs of Ambae's in the morning, I don't know I'd want to go to a job.
 
Last edited:

Redrider

Kava Curious
Thank you both for you responses.
Blinky: I had actually been using Nambawan exclusively until I received the Ambae's in the mail. I switched to that because of the reviews I'd read about how potent it is. Prior to the Nambawan, I had used Cactus' Mâlôlô (both the medium grind as well as the micro) and their Loa Lawena.
I'll have to stick with the Ambae's for a while longer.
I am reluctant to take the "monstrous dose" you suggested (although it's probably a good idea), as I suffer from a fairly intense anxiety disorder, and I worry about throwing myself out of whack.
Recent: I wish I had akava guide :)
Like I said above, a larger dose to kick me if the cliff - so to speak - is probably a good idea, but my anxiety disorder precludes me from doing that at the moment. A guide would be quite useful, indeed.

I'm still wondering if it's possible that two weeks is simply not long enough for me, for whatever reason .
 

Groggy

Kava aficionado
Admin
Hi and welcome to kavaforums. I am guessing you are drinking the kava and going to work? Try switching your routine for early evening before dinner (or any other time you have for yourself), specially given the kavas you mentioned drinking. It's hard to feel a kava's full effects when you are not taking the time to fully enjoy the experience and like blinkyrocket is saying, "listen to the kava".

I find this to be especially true when you first start drinking kava and don't quite know what to expect from the experience.
 

Redrider

Kava Curious
Krunky: Thank you.
Yes, I pretty much do that, because mornings are - by default - the easiest time to ensure that i am adhering to the rule of having no food for a few hours prior. I find it difficult to commit to not eating for that long during the day, and I suspect that it often takes my stomach a while to empty. Let me know if that rule is overhyped, and I'll happily drink it in the evenings :)
 

Groggy

Kava aficionado
Admin
Krunky: Thank you.
Yes, I pretty much do that, because mornings are - by default - the easiest time to ensure that i am adhering to the rule of having no food for a few hours prior. I find it difficult to commit to not eating for that long during the day, and I suspect that it often takes my stomach a while to empty. Let me know if that rule is overhyped, and I'll happily drink it in the evenings :)
You should definitely eat throughout the day, lol. I think 2-3 hours prior to drinking kava is plenty of time for your body to do most of the digestive heavy lifting. You don't need to be starving in order to enjoy kava's full effects and try increasing the dose slowly, it doesn't need to be all or nothing. If you are using 4 now, next time try 5, then 6 and so on, until you hit the dose that speaks to you :)

Kavalactones need time to build in your body and sometimes it may take a bit longer, it took me 10 days to really feel it and I was using Gaya caps..
 

Redrider

Kava Curious
You should definitely eat throughout the day, lol. I think 2-3 hours prior to drinking kava is plenty of time for your body to do most the digestive heavy lifting. You don't need to be starving in order to enjoy kava's full effects and try increasing the dose slowly, it doesn't need to be all or nothing. If you are using 4 now, next time try 5, then 6 and so on, until you hit the dose that speaks to you :).

Kavalactones need time to build in your body and sometimes it may take a bit longer, it took me 10 days to really feel it and I was using Gaya caps..
Ok. 2-3 hours is a game-changer. It seemed like folks were talking about 4-5 hours.
I shall try incremental steps, then. I really hope for results soon.
Thank you again.
 

Krunkie McKrunkface

Kava Connoisseur
Thank for the response.
I've been using: Ambae's from kava time, Nambawan from Bula Kava House, and occasionally Mâlôlô from Cactus Kava. It's my understanding that this would be classified as heavy - though I may be mistaken.
In terms of preparation; I've been blending them in the Vitamix for a decent amount of time, and then pouring into a cheesecloth bag and wringing out.
I've generally used approximately two tablespoons per serving, and I've been drinking tea servings about 20 minutes apart.
I don't think that I've felt any of what you mentioned. I'd very much like for it to work, though.
holy cow, those are three super awesome kavas you got. Only the KT Ambae is heavy, though, the others are balanced pretty much in the middle.

I would double from 2 to 4 TBS but titrate up, do 2.5 for a few days, then 3.0, then 3.5, then 4 till you hit your sweet spot. Of course, if you hit the sweet spot below 4, don't keep titrating up ('nlessin y'all wanna, which is also cool). If you're drinking 4 TBS prepped on an empty stomach every morning for two weeks and nothing happens, then you have to consider you might be one of the rare folks with no Trainable KL receptors. That's fairly rare, though, so you have a ways to go before giving up.

Make sure you keep that 20 minutes between shells rule, otherwise it's a lot easier to accidentally drink too much.
 
Last edited:

Krunkie McKrunkface

Kava Connoisseur
Nambawan is pretty surprising since I've felt the full brunt of dizziness and double vision etc. From that one, not to mention a buzz like no other. I will say that I had at least 10 tablespoons on that occassion - I seriously underestimated Nambawan that time. I'd say just to try a monstrous dose, just like mine, in order to break through so to speak. If still nothing happens, there's definitely something strange going on. You might also want to prepare Kava traditionally by giving it a good, rigorous kneading in a nut milk/Kava strainer bag. If you've ordered from Cactus Kava, I'd hedge a bet that they've also sent you a free strainer bag.

Ambae's is a heavy Kava, which means you should feel sedation and muscle relaxation. Nambawan should be very heady; it should be euphoric, energizing, and give you a buzz. I'm not sure about the one from Cactus Kava, but I do know Cactus Kava has some really good Kava despite the low potency. If you want something from Cactus Kava's Kava, you'll need at least 8 level tablespoons, I think.
Malolo is my favorite Cactus offering and I have no complaints about potency of 4Tbs of it (double balled in two washes to make a litre). I wouldn't call it strong, but neither is it weak. About average potency for a kava. Great flavor, and a soft, gentle balanced glow sort of grog. Nice stuff.
 

recentreturn

Kava Enthusiast
Ok. 2-3 hours is a game-changer. It seemed like folks were talking about 4-5 hours.
I shall try incremental steps, then. I really hope for results soon.
Thank you again.
Yeah, its not an absolute rule either. The empty stomach thing, for me, is more about getting the best bang for my buck. But I find even close to a kava session, a light snack, like a piece of fruit, doesn't ruin it.
 

Blinkyrocket

Kava Enthusiast
Malolo is my favorite Cactus offering and I have no complaints about potency of 4Tbs of it (double balled in two washes to make a litre). I wouldn't call it strong, but neither is it weak. About average potency for a kava. Great flavor, and a soft, gentle balanced glow sort of grog. Nice stuff.
Well, I was thinking Redrider might be insensitive to Kava's effects, just like I am. Course, I don't know so much if I'm insensitive to Kava or if I just expect not to be able to feel a small amount of Kava. Anyway, when I recommended a monstrous dose that may cause side effects, it's mainly because I think those doses could pretty much eliminate the possibility that Redrider is just experiencing reverse tolerance, or they could confirm it. With anxiety issues, I can definitely say it's not a good idea, though. Lol, I mean, I've been having zero anxiety issues lately and the only time in the past half a year, or so, that I've had anything close to a panic attack was when I underestimated Nambawan. It's frightening when it's unexpected, but I don't think it's intrinsically anxiogenic because I've had a few times after that where I got the same symptoms, of taking too much Kava, and wasn't too anxious about it at all.

Actually, I'm pretty sure that I've had zero anxiety issues for over a year now. I learned some meditation-esque practices like breathing exercises, and other mindfulness-based techniques focused on relaxing my muscles, and this seems to have been a very great boon towards my anxiety. I've learned that it's mainly the mindfulness that helps my anxiety.
 
Last edited:
Top