Why is K@ available in Kavabars, why not Scel or Mulungu instead?
oh boy, you've touched on a very heated subject.
The combination of the two is solely an American invention.
Here's a piece that the Kavasseur and I wrote up about the situation.
KavaKween
Kava Curious
Thank you, Kapmcrunk and Kavasseur, for an excellent article. There is a dangerous "cocktail" mentality in the US. It is frustrating and infuriating how it devalues nature's herbal gifts.
NCKavaKraver
Newbie
My 3 year relationship with K@ turned into a nightmare. K@ is addictive if used on a regular basis.
To those in this thread who are confused about why kava didn't want K@ associated with it...
Kava and K@ are often categorized together. K@ has an acute potential for abuse (responsible use is very possible, but regulators don't always see that).
If K@ becomes illegal which I could see happening, kava could be a casualty too just by association.
That's partially why people in this forum do their best to distance the two.
Kava and K@ are often categorized together. K@ has an acute potential for abuse (responsible use is very possible, but regulators don't always see that).
If K@ becomes illegal which I could see happening, kava could be a casualty too just by association.
That's partially why people in this forum do their best to distance the two.
Michael Nielsen
Kava Enthusiast
How many % of kavabars in US do sell both kava and K@?
kasa_balavu
Yaqona Dina
Over 95%.
The list of kava bars that don't sell K@ is a short one:
MeloMelo Kava Bar, CA
Bula Kava House, OR
Modernesian Kava, FL
Royal Kava Bar, UT
Bula Kava Bar, CA
Hopefully other forum members can think of more to add to that list.
The list of kava bars that don't sell K@ is a short one:
MeloMelo Kava Bar, CA
Bula Kava House, OR
Modernesian Kava, FL
Royal Kava Bar, UT
Bula Kava Bar, CA
Hopefully other forum members can think of more to add to that list.
Kanna can be grown in your flower pot. A tea is above average SSRI antidepressant, it is even procognitive and is not known to cause sexual side effects. Now there is a new SSRI that can boast these virtues too, actually (vortioxetine has better side effect profile).
Caveat - like kava kava and pharmaceutical antidepressants, kanna has interactions with other drugs.
Kanna works best to reduce bad mood and anxiety, yet it is not very recreational. At least if used as tea, it is good to excellent antidrpressant, serotonine-based but not only.
Caveat - like kava kava and pharmaceutical antidepressants, kanna has interactions with other drugs.
Kanna works best to reduce bad mood and anxiety, yet it is not very recreational. At least if used as tea, it is good to excellent antidrpressant, serotonine-based but not only.
_byron
Kava Enthusiast
9th island kava lounge, NV
Blergs
Kava Curious
It's a very different thing. Yes it is addictive, it interacts with the opioid receptors, so does chocolate etc, but it IS NOT an opioid. It has mild withdrawal of you suddenly stop and have been taking alot for a while.
But it being addictive should not be the main focus, concern or point, it should be IS IT SAFE, be it use or withdrawal, and it is!
But I DO NOT like shady sales, marketing and trying to hide it in kava products, that's just seriously very F ing wrong and shady! People that do this should be very ashamed of themselves .
I personally love K@, I deal with ALOT of pain and use it daily. It's a nice mood boost and energy boost too at lower doses.
I love kava too of course! Soo much so I end up with lizard skin from time to time lol, but it doesn't help my pain very much and I will not take pharma opiate pills, even though my doc has recommended it more than once.
Like anything, anything can be abused or end up not healthy or give side affects when used in extremes, be it coffee, sex, water, kava, fries etc.
Just do your research and well, on whatever you take, and not from places selling whatever you are looking to take!
Also personally I'd avoid any place that are marketing kava and K@ together because that's generally just very shady and out of greed.
If someone wants to mix it then they can do so on their own (I'd use caution though, and generally don't recommend it personally)
Blergs
Kava Curious
I love the kavasseur, but he is a bit biased against K@ and doesn't seem to fully informed either on the compound and its impacts/uses/usefulness imo, but I do agree on most of his points and in general overall.
Blergs
Kava Curious
100% agree
Don't hate me @Blergs
That article was written entirely by yours truly.
You see me posting research on the different platforms regarding kava research. Well, I do the same amount of research on that other plant as well, I just don't talk about it except for in forms such as that. I don't wish to add any negativity to the situation because there absolutely are people who need access to it. My issue comes into play with kava bars and such selling it as something as benign as milk. That rubs me the wrong way.
That's all. Nothing else to add or say in regards to this. When speaking on it I can EASILY step on people's toes, and I just don't want to.
Blergs
Kava Curious
Oops lol
I agree with you though on those points definitely.
It just bugs me the extremes. Like it's just a cup of water or milk, or omg it's an opiate you will die, it's very bad for you (it's not) , or I've even seen it said you will move on to heroin or pain pills . I mean there are some not very bright people out there of course , but it's safe for most.
I don't like either extreme, but mainly the extreme of it being this horrible plant growing out of the devil's ass lol
To try and answer the original question... I'm sure I have read that kava sales on their own may or may not be profitable enough to pay all the bills for a running business. Whether that's true or it's just an excuse I don't know, just putting the idea out.
I really wanted Sceletium tortuosum / Kanna to work, but the ones I've tried have had no noticeable effect on well-being.
The last one I tried was a 20:1 extract.
I was drawn to Kava because I had become physically dependent on K@ (in fact, this was my very first experience with dependence of any kind - I don't even drink coffee regularly) and I really liked the idea of a product NOT causing physical dependence. Kava is very hit-or-miss, and I've had to cut back on daily use due to dermopothy that was becoming noticeable to acquaintances (like when showing someone a phone video - "Your hands are ROUGH!")
The first time I tried Kanna was when I quit K@ cold-turkey. I got past acute withdrawals and had moved into the longer-lasting post-acute stuff.
I didn't want to try anything that would make my body go into withdrawals when I stopped using it, and had read good things about Kanna.
Tried stuffing it in my cheek, chewing with gum, capsules, etc.
However, I did not try smoking or insulflation (if I'm even spelling that right) but have read where that's not uncommon Kanna use.
Sidenote: There was this drink called "Limitless" that was sold in gas stations. Before they stopped selling it around here, it switched to Sceletium turtuosum as the main active (psychoactive) ingredient. That's when it "quit working", according to the guys I know who drank it. What was the original active ingredient? Phenibut.
(Effective maybe during the most difficult day of K@ withdrawal, but not for daily use.) They had a decent enough amount of this in the drink that people felt some degree of WDs when they'd go without it. I'm assuming this is about when the formula changed.
After trying three (3) doctor-prescribed antidepressants (Sertraline/Zoloft, Bupropion/Wellbutrin, Effexor), I started back with K@ at lower doses at set times of the day. It works for me, but alllllllllllllllways in my mind is the fact that I'm "on something".
I was able to clear up my Kava dermopathy painlessly. The closest thing to a "withdrawal"-type feeling was the fact that, NOT drinking Kava, I realized just HOW MUCH IT HAD BEEN HELPING ME SLEEP. So my sleep suffered, but my skin got real smooth.
But 100%, I understand WHY K@ is looked down on by Kava bars - it shouldn't be associated with Kava.
I cringe at the idea of people losing access to Kava somehow because of K@. Not necessarily me, but the fantastic people here who are using Kava to assist in dealing with debilitating or otherwise serious health issues. (...and I really wanted Kanna to work! But I'll look into Mulungu again. Only vaguely familiar with it. Thanks!)
The last one I tried was a 20:1 extract.
I was drawn to Kava because I had become physically dependent on K@ (in fact, this was my very first experience with dependence of any kind - I don't even drink coffee regularly) and I really liked the idea of a product NOT causing physical dependence. Kava is very hit-or-miss, and I've had to cut back on daily use due to dermopothy that was becoming noticeable to acquaintances (like when showing someone a phone video - "Your hands are ROUGH!")
The first time I tried Kanna was when I quit K@ cold-turkey. I got past acute withdrawals and had moved into the longer-lasting post-acute stuff.
I didn't want to try anything that would make my body go into withdrawals when I stopped using it, and had read good things about Kanna.
Tried stuffing it in my cheek, chewing with gum, capsules, etc.
However, I did not try smoking or insulflation (if I'm even spelling that right) but have read where that's not uncommon Kanna use.
Sidenote: There was this drink called "Limitless" that was sold in gas stations. Before they stopped selling it around here, it switched to Sceletium turtuosum as the main active (psychoactive) ingredient. That's when it "quit working", according to the guys I know who drank it. What was the original active ingredient? Phenibut.
(Effective maybe during the most difficult day of K@ withdrawal, but not for daily use.) They had a decent enough amount of this in the drink that people felt some degree of WDs when they'd go without it. I'm assuming this is about when the formula changed.
After trying three (3) doctor-prescribed antidepressants (Sertraline/Zoloft, Bupropion/Wellbutrin, Effexor), I started back with K@ at lower doses at set times of the day. It works for me, but alllllllllllllllways in my mind is the fact that I'm "on something".
I was able to clear up my Kava dermopathy painlessly. The closest thing to a "withdrawal"-type feeling was the fact that, NOT drinking Kava, I realized just HOW MUCH IT HAD BEEN HELPING ME SLEEP. So my sleep suffered, but my skin got real smooth.
But 100%, I understand WHY K@ is looked down on by Kava bars - it shouldn't be associated with Kava.
I cringe at the idea of people losing access to Kava somehow because of K@. Not necessarily me, but the fantastic people here who are using Kava to assist in dealing with debilitating or otherwise serious health issues. (...and I really wanted Kanna to work! But I'll look into Mulungu again. Only vaguely familiar with it. Thanks!)
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I agree with you on this. I live in a place where K@ is legal but, now because it is sold in a new head-shop that opened up (we had NONE), our local government is trying to ban sales in the city, and push up the ladder to have it banned across the state.
Personally I buy it online from the same place for the past 3 years, and I hate that it is SO accessible. Someone who never even considered it is now looking at it as a recreational substance Oh, and the bottled/liquid K@ is popular!
But, yeah - I read recently in a Reddit thread where someone got on Suboxone to get off K@. That is sad, man.
Blergs
Kava Curious
Ffs