Kava causing me HPPD... why?

[BourbonMac]

It's like I've been doing shrooms or DMT regularly for awhile, but I haven't. I mean I used to quite frequently, but lately just using kava, letters on screens get all wobbly and warped in the same way they did after I'd binge DMT, the exact same way. This can't be a normal reaction, and I do use noble kava (kalmwithkava, fijivanuakava). I don't take anything else that could cause this.

 

[mlenny]

That is unusual. Is there any chance that it's exacerbating HPPD symptoms (commonly referred to as a "flashback")? That's all I myself can think of.

Matthew

 

[BourbonMac]

I don't think so, I haven't taken a psychedelic since last August, which was one DMT trip. I did it a lot from March to May but didn't even have the wobbly letters to this extent. When I did DMT for 30 days straight once, around 23 days in I did notice wobbly text and intense closed eye visuals often while cracking my neck with my eyes closed, but I've never really had HPPD that didn't go away. So I haven't really used psychedelics regularly since last May to early June.

 

[Groggy]

It's like I've been doing shrooms or DMT regularly for awhile, but I haven't. I mean I used to quite frequently, but lately just using kava, letters on screens get all wobbly and warped in the same way they did after I'd binge DMT, the exact same way. This can't be a normal reaction, and I do use noble kava (kalmwithkava, fijivanuakava). I don't take anything else that could cause this.

Kava is not the culprit, the obvious answer is all the other drugs you are using.

 

[ThePiper]

Kava can cause very slight perceptual shifts that can include vision brightening etc but definitely never heard of what you describe.

 

[BourbonMac]

Kava is not the culprit, the obvious answer is all the other drugs you are using.

I haven't taken anything like that in forever my vision has been fine. It all started when begun high doses of kava. Maybe it's just a personal side effect, idk. I don't know if it's truly HPPD or just similar. Wobbly letters could apply to any substance.

 

[Groggy]

I haven't taken anything like that in forever my vision has been fine. It all started when begun high doses of kava. Maybe it's just a personal side effect, idk. I don't know if it's truly HPPD or just similar. Wobbly letters could apply to any substance.

Then cut back, drink more water. Lucky for us kava is not addictive

 

[BourbonMac]

I seem psychologically addicted to it at least. But then again, I'm just as addicted to drinking chamomile tea every night. Basically every night for about 2 years now, it's be harder for me to quit that. If something becomes a ritual then I have a hard time breaking it. But I also use high doses of kava because I have chronic tinnitus and it tends to result in significant improvement. There's no science behind it, that's just something it can do for me.

 

[Intrepidus_dux]

Just to clarify, are you saying you're getting ear problems or is it more of a hallucination issue?

 

[BourbonMac]

No, the tinnitus began as a complication from sinus surgery. Actually it started before, mild, the surgery corrected it and it got a lot worse. Then when I started drinking kava late December 2022 into January 2023 I noticed my tinnitus had greatly improved.

I'm currently on Fluconazole as a shot in the dark and it helps even more. There's some issue between my throat sinuses and ears. Seen a lot of ENTs and got no answers. Niacin and hot showers make it go away for awhile, usually. But no it's not a hallucination type thing.

And if I consume THC it makes it go waaaaay up for some reason (usually). So I tend not to use it much. I was never really exposed to loud noise, haven't been to many concerts. I did go to a very loud local heavy metal concert in July and smoked a lot of weed. When I was about to leave I'm just thinking, wow, my ears are going to be FUCKED. It actually completely got rid of my tinnitus, even after I blew fluid into my right ear blowing my nose too hard, it didn't cause tinnitus. I was bedazzled.

 

[Intrepidus_dux]

Ok, I understand what you're saying now. Kava can make it worse if you're not staying well hydrated enough. Anytime you have a change in the consistency of your mucous it can set off ear issues. Kava can still affect your vestibular system if you are well hydrated but allergies continue to go unaddressed because it can increase some similar substance in your body. If you tried what groggy said above, and you feel you're fully hydrated, try treating your allergies. Maybe see your ENT again. I had vestibular system problems for years. Certain times of year kava would make it a bit worse for me. Surgery helped but I still have horrendous allergies. Do you use a humidifier? There's some nice relaxing ones on amazon that change colors. It'll help your sinsuses and any potential kava skin. It's relaxing to watch during a kava session as well.

 

[BourbonMac]

Kava helps my ears though, it doesn't make it worse. I've generally been able to avoid skin issues thanks to taking high doses of niacin in the evening to end my tinnitus for a few hours. I got dermo so much sooner last year but I've been on kava 2 months and no sign of it, I can only guess the niacin flush is why.

I've seen 6 or 7 different ENTs and none of them have been able to give me any answer other than "sorry, tinnitus is a misunderstood condition that usually happens in the brain." Well, mine is different. If niacin can make it stop, increasing bloodflow to the ear, if showers can help (idk why), there has to be a real fix. This fluconazole has really been helping though. So many times I'd swallow water and my ear would plug and start screaming. Lately, that hasn't been the case. I used to have a humidifier, it broke. Should probably get one again as I've had nosebleeds due to how dry and cold it's been.

 

[Groggy]

Ok, I understand what you're saying now. Kava can make it worse if you're not staying well hydrated enough. Anytime you have a change in the consistency of your mucous it can set off ear issues. Kava can still affect your vestibular system if you are well hydrated but allergies continue to go unaddressed because it can increase some similar substance in your body. If you tried what groggy said above, and you feel you're fully hydrated, try treating your allergies. Maybe see your ENT again. I had vestibular system problems for years. Certain times of year kava would make it a bit worse for me. Surgery helped but I still have horrendous allergies. Do you use a humidifier? There's some nice relaxing ones on amazon that change colors. It'll help your sinsuses and any potential kava skin. It's relaxing to watch during a kava session as well.

This is excellent advice, thank you! I am going to try the humidifier since I also suffer from allergies and it seems to be getting worse as I get closer to good ol' 50 lol.

 

[the_wilderness]

well, it's normal for me, i assumed it was par for the course. I have a remarkably small window between feeling anything and overdoing it (within a gram sometimes), so I find myself in the place *just* before too much often. Too much and vision blurs completely; just before that is what you're describing, esp with the wobbly, warping letters on a screen. I do take what is considered a high dose for some (20g of instant straight up, and then another 3 hrs later) because closer second doses tend to hit me badly with side effects, regardless of initial dosing. It might be that those getting a better spectrum of effects just aren't pushing into the blurry zone.

 

[Pzk]

Due to I am a bit into "shamanism", at least I am on my way to study it, and lets see how far I come (so I am NO shaman), to me Kava was always more than just a "non-psychedelic" from the beginning.

Especially 1-2 days after consuming (depending on mind state, cultivar and dose), I have very lucid dream worlds, and other experiences. But this forum is the wrong place to discuss it or to go more into details.

Also I had experiences while consuming kava directly (not the 1-2 days after). It isn't the same as strong psychedelics, but to me it has psychedelic qualities - no question.

I had HPPD once after a Peru Trip many years ago, which went away after 2 years +/- . But the effect of kava differs very much to this HPPD I had, it is something completely different.

Seems some people are just a bit "broken up/open" and react different to things like Kava. Or some people have a very sensitive body and brain chemistry. Leaky blood brain barrier, btw, seems to be existing, too. Many Drs aren't aware of that, sadly. Some don't even believe in leaky gut.

Remembering a youtube video of a tribe on an island who used kava to connect to their ancestors.