"Please do not use kava. It can cause liver failure."

[kasa_balavu]

Is there a doctor or similarly credentialed person on here who can get in touch with this doctor and try to educate her on kava, as well as find out more about the case she thinks was caused by kava? We need to find out what else the patient was on, and what type of kava product he/she was using.

I don't think she'll care what random people on the internet tweet @ her.

 

[kasa_balavu]

It's a great pity there isn't a *real* American Kava Association to handle situations like this.

 

[Deleted User01]

It's a great pity there isn't a *real* American Kava Association to handle situations like this.

It's just a bunch of kava bar owners and the Tiger Pups (junior Chinese hackers) already defaced the AKA forums. Back in the 1990s, during the Kava Craze, there were all manner of bad extracts made from everything and including the aerial parts. It is thought these bad extracts were responsible for some medical complaints. That and of course mixing Kava with alcohol. Who were the worst vendors? The Chinese of course. Man, they sure got it in for Kava.

But that being said, I wonder if there was a patient that was buying bad extracts on the internet and washing it down with booze and who eventually fell ill. FYI, I read a weird complaint against a kava bar claiming they were putting Cocoa leaves in the kava and selling all sorts of stuff. Of course it was anonymous. Though the bar does indeed sell K@, you have to take the internet posts with no proof and no real author with a grain of salt. And if you ask the doctor and she says, "A little bird told me", then that's as viable as saying "I don't want to reveal my journalistic source". Anyone can throw around false claims with no proof and get it away with it anymore. There otta be a law.

 

[sɥɐʞɐs]

At a quick glance, it appears she's running for congress too...we don't need more misinformed people having the power to be lawmakers. She really needs to better informed.

Another thing I see, is that she appears to be from the Salt Lake City area of Utah -- there is a huge Tongan/Polynesian community there...so I don't doubt she's come across kava drinkers and probably kava drinkers that have health problems. But there are other factors that need to be considered, such as 1) this is the place where "Red Magic" was popular, that is mixing kava with Somatomax (phenibut + other) to boost the effects, 2) The likelihood that Kava drinkers there might also regularly drink alcohol, if not even mix the two for the same reason as the 'Red Magic' mix. 3) The fact that many Polynesians are obese, which creates higher instances of fatty liver disease on it's own. (the same is true for all people of course) 4) I've read plenty of Twitter & Instagram threads from salt lake area kava drinkers over the years and it's not uncommon for them to talk about drinking tudei Kava, especially in reference to it's ability to knacker you.

 

[Kraken]

In my visits to local kava bar I ran into people that are more than excited to drink their kava on top of their alcohol people sad thing is is when you Tell A lot of these individuals that they shouldn't do this they say yeah whatever then whenever they're dying they want to label kava as the problem misuse of any drug or substance no matter what it is can damage you just try to be smart people if you know it's not good for you don't freaking do it.

Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk

 

[Deleted User01]

Good detective work Shakas. I wonder how the Mormons feel about kava? Probably the same as they feel for alcohol. And now you know why we are against K@ in Kava bars. Why get the PTA moms and Politicians any more ammo. We got that same problem in texas where the religious right politicians are passing laws dictating what bathroom transgendered children can use. If you look at the definition of Christian, they are not good Christians. But that's another topic for an other forum. But those same guys would burn Kava if we gave them half an excuse.

 

[Krunkie McKrunkface]

One of my fantasies is to lobby the Seventh Day Adventists to remove their ban on kava. They wiped it out of many islands, and that production is precious.

 

[Alia]

Is there a doctor or similarly credentialed person on here who can get in touch with this doctor and try to educate her on kava, as well as find out more about the case she thinks was caused by kava? We need to find out what else the patient was on, and what type of kava product he/she was using.

I don't think she'll care what random people on the internet tweet @ her.

Is this only via twitter? I can find no quotes from her regarding kava and I never tweet ---but would like to send her a comment regarding traditional kava beverage.
If anyone can help lead me to the specifics (without getting involved with twitter) I would appreciate.

 

[The Kap'n]

One of my fantasies is to lobby the Seventh Day Adventists to remove their ban on kava. They wiped it out of many islands, and that production is precious.

What gets me is that Brigham Young in Hawaii doesn't allow it's transfer students from Fiji to drink kava who take part in their Polynesian Cultural Center. Come on BYU Hawaii.

I discovered this while watching an episode of Huang's World on Viceland.

 

[Rick.Sanchez]

I have no problem with religious people, but I do have a problem with people who try to impose their religion on others. I also hate when people view separation of church and state as a threat to their religion. So much outrage about removing Christian symbols from government.

We could also do many of the things Jesus actually preached, like feed the hungry, clothe the needy, take care if the sick, etc. if we spent slightly less on killing people

 

[-33-]

Almost anything "can" cause liver failure in large enough amounts, or mixed with other things.
Hilarious how the #1 cause of liver failure "alcohol" never gets tweets like this...
"Hey guys, don't ever drink beer, one of my patients had liver failure from it" .. sounds ridiculous in that context

 

[verticity]

At a quick glance, it appears she's running for congress too...we don't need more misinformed people having the power to be lawmakers. She really needs to better informed.

Another thing I see, is that she appears to be from the Salt Lake City area of Utah -- there is a huge Tongan/Polynesian community there...so I don't doubt she's come across kava drinkers and probably kava drinkers that have health problems. But there are other factors that need to be considered, such as 1) this is the place where "Red Magic" was popular, that is mixing kava with Somatomax (phenibut + other) to boost the effects, 2) The likelihood that Kava drinkers there might also regularly drink alcohol, if not even mix the two for the same reason as the 'Red Magic' mix. 3) The fact that many Polynesians are obese, which creates higher instances of fatty liver disease on it's own. (the same is true for all people of course) 4) I've read plenty of Twitter & Instagram threads from salt lake area kava drinkers over the years and it's not uncommon for them to talk about drinking tudei Kava, especially in reference to it's ability to knacker you.

From what I gather from reading her twitter account: she is a doctor who is running for congress from Utah like you say. I think in addition to Polynesian immigrants, kava is kind of a thing there for some LDS people (Mormons) as an alcohol alternative, even though it might not be officially approved by the church. In her twitter feed, she fields a lot of questions from people about opiate and alcohol addiction. She seems to have some general knowledge of medicine. She is in favor of medical MJ for treating chronic pain, and is also OK with things like pharmaceutical antidepressants and methadone/suboxone, and ideologically she does not seem like the kind of person who would be irrationally hostile to kava. Someone asked her about krat**, and she had no idea what it is, though. I can't find the tweet about kava; perhaps it has been deleted. But it seems she just doesn't know much about natural medicines such as kava and krat, which is actually pretty typical for doctors. Her claim that a patient of hers who was using kava suffered liver failure is interesting, but considering the fact that she seems to be in the business of treating people for addiction, who knows what else the patient was taking.

 

[verticity]

Is this only via twitter? I can find no quotes from her regarding kava and I never tweet ---but would like to send her a comment regarding traditional kava beverage.
If anyone can help lead me to the specifics (without getting involved with twitter) I would appreciate.

You mean: why would a politician running for office expect that they could be taken seriously by randomly tweeting out 140-word pronouncements?
But here is the contact form on her campaign web site where you can send her a message:
https://www.drkathieforcongress.com/contact/

 

[Kaptain Kava]

So where's her evidence that her patients liver wasn't already in bad condition before the kava? She deals with patients addictions. I doubt her patient was only taking kava.

 

[Rick.Sanchez]

So where's her evidence that her patients liver wasn't already in bad condition before the kava? She deals with patients addictions. I doubt her patient was only taking kava.

I doubt she'll be providing any evidence. It would take some time to provide HIPAA friendly documentation. I think verticity hit the nail on the head. I don't think she knows much about medicinal botanicals.

 

[verticity]

It also should be noted that this doctor has been practicing medicine since 1987. The incident she mentioned could have happened any time since then...

 

[kastom_lif]

I've heard from LDS missionaries to the South Pacific that they're not permitted to drink kava. They're also not allowed to swim, for some reason.

Peace Corps Vanuatu doesn't let volunteers ride bicycles.

Everybody seems to have weird taboos.

 

[blindy107]

.. if we spent slightly less on killing people

But they pray to a different god than we do.

 

[Krunkie McKrunkface]

But they pray to a different god than we do.

Rabbit God! Duck God! Rabbit season! Duck Season!

 

[Alia]

Is there a doctor or similarly credentialed person on here who can get in touch with this doctor and try to educate her on kava, as well as find out more about the case she thinks was caused by kava? We need to find out what else the patient was on, and what type of kava product he/she was using.

I don't think she'll care what random people on the internet tweet @ her.

I did reach out to her communications director. He responded almost immediately (within a few hours anyway). My comment was my standard line regarding traditional kava beverage historical record of safe use. I included adequate references. His reply was to more fully explain what could not possibly be within a "tweet" (as @verticity so eloquently put it) . A quick rundown of his reply, first - " self-medicated use of kava (pills , extract, not traditional beverage) as a treatment for anxiety, ". "This is not referring to the use of the beverage in traditional ceremonies". , etc. "Dr. Allen believes that anxiety, like other medical conditions, should be treated through the procedures established by medical professionals, with the well-being of the patient". "She believes in peer-reviewed scientific research, and the JAMA quote you provided is appreciated". OK, so much for tweets. So much for kava pills and extracts not actually being kava.