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What makes a kava tincture dangerous?

Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Kava Connoisseur
Sadly if the FKB levels are from noble. then there is 11 x the amount of Kls vs water but 161.5 times more FKB than water.... is it worth it.... if this is true then no. but i still dont believe it is.
 
Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Kava Connoisseur
dihydromethysticin (60 mg) and yangonin (30 mg), methysticin (66 mg), kawain (38 mg), dihydrokawain (23 mg), and desmethoxyyangonin (12 mg).

Seeing this slightly leads me to believe a possible tuedi cultivar? @Deleted User @Gourmet Hawaiian Kava ?? If someone more experienced can answer that? this is the chemo type of the kind used
 
Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Kava Connoisseur
Very interesting as many of us here dont enjoy the effect of yangonin much

"We initially screened all 6 major kavalactones and 3 chalcones for cytotoxicity toward HepG2 hepatoma cells using MTT assays. None of the kavalactones, except yangonin, exhibited toxicity at concentrations up to 150 μM (Fig. 1A). Yagonin is a weak toxin with apparent LD50 of 100 μM (Fig. 1A)."
 
HeadHodge

HeadHodge

Bula To Eternity
Mrbinx69 said:
Right off the bat we have a 56

564321 is this samples chemotype? sound like any nobles headgie? i know you still have the charts from when you were compiling chemos @HeadHodge
Click to expand...
Anything with a 5 in the high order 3 digits of the chemotype has a very high statistical probability of being tudei (based on Harpos posted database anyways)
 
Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Kava Connoisseur
As far as i remember a 5 in the FIRST especially is tuedi.
This could collapse the entire study based on our standards. It being May of 2010 the Noble movement as we know it didnt even start yet. So the probability that it was tuedi would be even higher imo
 
HeadHodge

HeadHodge

Bula To Eternity
Mrbinx69 said:
As far as i remember a 5 in the FIRST especially is tuedi.
This could collapse the entire study based on our standards. It being May of 2010 the Noble movement as we know it didnt even start yet. So the probability that it was tuedi would be even higher imo
Click to expand...
I would assume it's tudei. If your goofing around with tinctures I would really be interested in the FK extraction for a noble with and without the makas. Because I believe the micros GHK sells are supposedly makas free, so that would come closer to answering your original question (consuming a tincture vs toss n wash of a micro)
 
CactusKava

CactusKava

Phoenix, AZ
Kava Vendor
HeadHodge said:
I would assume it's tudei. If your goofing around with tinctures I would really be interested in the FK extraction for a noble with and without the makas. Because I believe the micros GHK sells are supposedly makas free, so that would come closer to answering your original question (consuming a tincture vs toss n wash of a micro)
Click to expand...
@Mrbinx69

Check this thread out: http://kavaforums.com/forum/threads/acetone-test-and-flavokawain-b-content.3504/

It is a little older, but still has a lot of information. A few quotes:

@Deleted User said: "Dose does apply to FKB, and we know tudei has it in at least 4x the concentration of noble. We also know extracts are an issue because of unknown elements extracted, and that concomitant medication may be a factor. "

So while FKB might be bad for you, it might not be the cause of liver toxicity.

Regardless, he also said "As far as I know, HPLC would be the easiest way to test for actual FKB content. I imagine a specific test could be developed, but it would be quite complex and well beyond me. Since FKB may or may not be the actual "smoking gun", there is little need at this point."

He's come a long way since that time though, so maybe he has a way now?
 
Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Kava Connoisseur
137 mg is a drastic difference ! Vs 548!

That makes it a much more reasonable difference. If we broke it down to 50 50 again then we're looking at decently low levels.. 60 mg or so. Per 400 mg or so kavalactones.. that's a lot better of a trade off.
 
CactusKava

CactusKava

Phoenix, AZ
Kava Vendor
I think the real question is: How do you study hepatoxicity? What would I need to do in order to find out if something is harmful to a liver? Is it only through clinical trials? Is there a way we can simulate a liver, and inject bajillions of FKBs to see if it really does have adverse reactions from it?

We don't know if FKBs cause hepatoxicity. Doing all of this work to stop FKBs from being extracted might be for no good reason.
 
Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Zac Imiola (Herbalist)

Kava Connoisseur
The color of this is coming out alot more browny orange with a hint of yellow ... much different than standard extract .. more grog colored.
Just like cannabis is green vs. Yellow only extract when isolated
 
HeadHodge

HeadHodge

Bula To Eternity
CactusKava said:
I think the real question is: How do you study hepatoxicity? What would I need to do in order to find out if something is harmful to a liver? Is it only through clinical trials? Is there a way we can simulate a liver, and inject bajillions of FKBs to see if it really does have adverse reactions from it?

We don't know if FKBs cause hepatoxicity. Doing all of this work to stop FKBs from being extracted might be for no good reason.
Click to expand...
My liver is a living laboratory. If I stop posting here, it's because my last trial failed. :wideyed::)
 
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