Ben Thomas
Kava Enthusiast
Last big hitters I had were the squanch waka and nangol noble. What do you guys suggest for my next knock out sleep strain? Was thinking about the other squanch, lawena.
Heavy night time?
- Thread starter Ben Thomas
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Honolulusurfer88
Kava Curious
People have been recommending Kava Supreme for a while now. Coming from being a huge Stone fanboy, I have been skeptical of it and just hadn't tried it ever though I have and enjoy their blender bottle thing. Finally tried a batch of Supreme this week and I couldn't have been more wrong to hesitate. I see why it gets mentioned here so often. In my opinion it is on par with stone which has always had a reputation as being pretty heavy. Great stuff. I got into kava for its heaviness and since I refuse to open my 2015 and pre-controversy-2016 bags of Stone 
I've been bumping around, trying different kavas to find something with that same heaviness and for me Supreme has got it. Props to Kavafied.
I've been bumping around, trying different kavas to find something with that same heaviness and for me Supreme has got it. Props to Kavafied. 
kastom_lif
Kava Lover
Currently available heavies: Kavafied Kava Supreme, KWK borongoru, Kava Vinaka waka, Squanch waka, GHK hanakapiʻai.
Back when Vanuatu Kava Store was around, their Maewo borogu and Tanna marang were both pretty heavy. May have been spiked with tudei, I dunno... but it was deep.
As for the dreaded isa... I've had Hawaiian-grown from Rex as well as PNG koniak. I'm not a huge fan. You sleep like a log and then the next morning is foggy. Headaches and nausea seem to come more quickly if you drink a lot.
Back when Vanuatu Kava Store was around, their Maewo borogu and Tanna marang were both pretty heavy. May have been spiked with tudei, I dunno... but it was deep.
As for the dreaded isa... I've had Hawaiian-grown from Rex as well as PNG koniak. I'm not a huge fan. You sleep like a log and then the next morning is foggy. Headaches and nausea seem to come more quickly if you drink a lot.
SelfBiasResistor
Persist for Resistance!
Other than Supreme and what you've listed, there aren't a lot of viable options for heavy kava right now unless you are one of the numerous (and very lucky) lightweights. FWIW, I've gotten a couple bags of Supreme that had to be diluted with extra water or weaker kava to not have too much of a "knock out" effect.
I've bought a lot of Borongoru and Hanakapi but lately they have not been at the same level they were in the past.
Krunkie McKrunkface
Kava Connoisseur
fwiw I find the KWK borogu heavier than their borongoru, which I find more balanced, and nicer tasting. That borogu is heavy and piney.
Ben Thomas
Kava Enthusiast
Went with the supreme
I don't know, I don't equate Squanch with a heavy kava in normal doses, at the rate I drink it, I can see how some may see it that way. Anyways heavy hitters for me, though rare or have been, BKH Nangol Noble, GHK Hanakapi'ai, Kava Supreme, GHK Hiwa and KWK Borongoru.
Zaphod
Kava Lover
Love the Kava Supreme along with GHK's Hanakapi'ai both usually do it for me. Just out of curiosity, if one were interested, what Isa would recommend for a relatively experienced kava drinker but newbie to tudeis?
Any Isa should do, so long as it's authentically Isa. Anyone interested or inexperienced, probably shouldn't be thinking of making Isa their daily full dose kava. If you feel compelled to try it, make a half dose compared to your usual amount...or just use a couple tablespoons to give some body/depth to one sided heady or weak kava. If you do okay with that, you might want to drink a full-dose Isa experience on a weekend or something. It's not drastically different from any other heavy kava...but occasionally it can surprise you, sometimes positively and sometimes negatively. And some people respond better or worse than others.
recentreturn
Kava Enthusiast
Recognizing that we are getting off topic here... I am wondering what it is that makes the SUBJECTIVE experience of Isa/Tudei different? (I've never had it) Is it just the chemotype, is the quantity of kavalactones way higher, or do these other pytochemicals (flavo-whatevers) everyone is talking about being so high in it have some psychoactivity? I've perused the "what is isa" thread but never seemed to find an answer to this question. Is there something different in its psychoactive profile that makes it so unpredictable? Or are we just talking about nausea and non-psychoactive side effects or something akin to taking too much noble kava?
Unpredictability of effects isn't unique to tudei kavas, noble kavas can also mysteriously be distinctly more (or less) effective from one night to the next and also the subjective effects each user feels from a particular variety can occasionally vary somewhat drastically between individuals. We aren't quite sure why this happens. This extends to tudei kavas as well, the only difference being; if a tudei happens to "hit you wrong", it will be more unpleasant than you'd ever typically experience with a noble kava.
In general, the difference in perceived effects between tudei & most noble kava is mostly due the significantly higher prevalence of the kavalactone "DiHydroMethysticin" (#5), which is longer acting, has a stronger body effect, is more sedating and is more likely to cause nausea. While other minor differences, like the amount of flavokavains, might play some role, it's probably to a much lesser degree than the amount of DHM and DHK which typify tudeis.