determinants of kava prices

[TheKavaSociety]

Hi all, we posted a blog post looking into determinants of kava prices a few weeks ago. A hot topic right now with prices obviously on the rise. Hope you ll find it interesting. Appreciate any feedback

What determines the price of kava? Can good kava be cheap?

From cutting to cup, kava takes years of patient farming and many quality choices to produce. We explain what actually determines the price of kava and how to spot real value.

kavasociety.com

 

[JohnMichael]

Hi all, we posted a blog post looking into determinants of kava prices a few weeks ago. A hot topic right now with prices obviously on the rise. Hope you ll find it interesting. Appreciate any feedback

What determines the price of kava? Can good kava be cheap?

From cutting to cup, kava takes years of patient farming and many quality choices to produce. We explain what actually determines the price of kava and how to spot real value.

kavasociety.com

Thanks for posting. Makes a lot of good points.

 

[Groggy]

Hi all, we posted a blog post looking into determinants of kava prices a few weeks ago. A hot topic right now with prices obviously on the rise. Hope you ll find it interesting. Appreciate any feedback

What determines the price of kava? Can good kava be cheap?

From cutting to cup, kava takes years of patient farming and many quality choices to produce. We explain what actually determines the price of kava and how to spot real value.

kavasociety.com

There is a lot involved processing kava, more than I had realized. Thank you for having written this. I particularly like the section at the end, in relation to quality and claims by vendors.

 

[yiki]

"At no point in history has high-quality kava been more easily available and more affordable to customers around the globe."

Sorry, but i remember a time before a certain hurricane, where you could get kava fpr 50€ a kg in europe and it was like double the strength. I thought i was imagining the last part but then i tried some leftover kava from that time period and it was so potent its insane.

 

[TheKavaSociety]

"At no point in history has high-quality kava been more easily available and more affordable to customers around the globe."

Sorry, but i remember a time before a certain hurricane, where you could get kava fpr 50€ a kg in europe and it was like double the strength. I thought i was imagining the last part but then i tried some leftover kava from that time period and it was so potent its insane.

€50 euro before Pam is close to €75 euro today in inflation adjusted terms. Obviously buying kava in Europe also exposes you to general inflation in freight, insurance, compliance etc costs beyond the cost of kava itself.

Also, I would argue that, subjective perception of potency aside no kava sold 15 years ago was of the quality you can access today in terms of purity, food safety, freshness etc. in terms of objective, quantifiable potency (kl %, all the shortcomings of only looking at kl% notwithstanding), these can fluctuate a bit between batches, cultivars etc, but have stayed overall fairly consistent *for the same product type* (eg well peeled single cultivar melo)

 

[yiki]

Also, I would argue that, subjective perception of potency aside no kava sold 15 years ago was of the quality you can access today in terms of purity, food safety, freshness etc.

Are there any studies about this, or why do you believe this to be true? Honestly, i also thought it was just a case of "the good old days", but after i tried kava i had from this time again, i noticed a huge difference. I took only 20-30g and it felt like 60g. Or even stronger.

 

[TheKavaSociety]

Are there any studies about this, or why do you believe this to be true? Honestly, i also thought it was just a case of "the good old days", but after i tried kava i had from this time again, i noticed a huge difference. I took only 20-30g and it felt like 60g. Or even stronger.

We have been drinking and importing kava since 2011 and I ve been looking at lab data for years. And we do sell our kava through a kava bar in Auckland that gives us a good opportunity for continuous flow of feedback.

I just dont see any decrease in quantitative indicators for the same grade products. If anything, improvements in drying, packing etc seem to improve subjective perceptions of potency despite the same kl %. I also dont see why kava should become weaker if one maintains the same quality. If you buy mature and healthy plants, there is no reason why it should suddenly become weaker.

It is possible some kava from years ago had higher kl% bc it was pure laterals or it was unpeeled (skin has higher kl%). We do sell 100% laterals, but despite it being the strongest product in terms of kl%, it is very far from being our bestseller. People strongly prefer natural ratio single cultivars.

Your perception could be due to lateral content, or maybe just a subjective thing due to a different cultivar. People often report feelimg stronger effects when they switch between cultivars

 

[yiki]

Maybe they do not like the taste of mighty roots and it also does not have the character as the other kavas. I would think it has to do with KS being a brand for conossieurs who appreciate the fine subtleties more than pure power.

 

[JohnMichael]

We have been drinking and importing kava since 2011 and I ve been looking at lab data for years. And we do sell our kava through a kava bar in Auckland that gives us a good opportunity for continuous flow of feedback.

I just dont see any decrease in quantitative indicators for the same grade products. If anything, improvements in drying, packing etc seem to improve subjective perceptions of potency despite the same kl %. I also dont see why kava should become weaker if one maintains the same quality. If you buy mature and healthy plants, there is no reason why it should suddenly become weaker.

It is possible some kava from years ago had higher kl% bc it was pure laterals or it was unpeeled (skin has higher kl%). We do sell 100% laterals, but despite it being the strongest product in terms of kl%, it is very far from being our bestseller. People strongly prefer natural ratio single cultivars.

Your perception could be due to lateral content, or maybe just a subjective thing due to a different cultivar. People often report feelimg stronger effects when they switch between cultivars

Yes, on all the above points...

 

[TheKavaSociety]

Maybe they do not like the taste of mighty roots and it also does not have the character as the other kavas. I would think it has to do with KS being a brand for conossieurs who appreciate the fine subtleties more than pure power.

Perhaps. But it is also a different experience in my view. Kava isnt alcohol. It's not like kl% is the equivalent of alcohol content in beer/wine etc. There is more to the quality or even intensity of experience, effects than just total kl%.

 

[Orz[EST]]

Oh no, kl% is not agood i dicator at all.
One high yangonin kava was a bloody stimulant.
Dihydromethysticin is probably the long term unpleasant antipsychotic that is felt primarily throughout the next day, etc.

Mighty Roots caused me to experience relaxation in eyemuscles that made reading impossible in not that high dose, very unusual (and no way recreational) while Pacific Elixir is a very well rounded one for me, master of none but a really really well rounded universal no fault kava for me.

 

[yiki]

Oh no, kl% is not agood i dicator at all.
One high yangonin kava was a bloody stimulant.
Dihydromethysticin is probably the long term unpleasant antipsychotic that is felt primarily throughout the next day, etc.

Mighty Roots caused me to experience relaxation in eyemuscles that made reading impossible in not that high dose, very unusual (and no way recreational) while Pacific Elixir is a very well rounded one for me, master of none but a really really well rounded universal no fault kava for me.

Maybe its the lack of yangonin in recent kavas that makes it feel less potent to me. Personally, if i get the eye relaxation, the cross eyed effects that's when it really hits the spot for me. I like kavas that create that tingly buzzing effect making you space out completly. Mighty Root feels like Bir Kar mixed with smth else and i really do not like Bir Kar.

 

[TheKavaSociety]

Maybe its the lack of yangonin in recent kavas that makes it feel less potent to me. Personally, if i get the eye relaxation, the cross eyed effects that's when it really hits the spot for me. I like kavas that create that tingly buzzing effect making you space out completly. Mighty Root feels like Bir Kar mixed with smth else and i really do not like Bir Kar.

Sometimes it's a matter of different water to root ratio and pacing. Different kavalactones have different peak brain concentration times.

Both us and Kava Europe publish *all* COAs for every single batch we sell, so you can perhaps take note of specific batches/cultivars that hit the right spot to you and see if there was anything unique in the chemistry that may explain it (often times it's more on the consumers' body chemistry side). Beyond chemistry, if you ever encounter a batch you particularly like or dislike, drop me an e-mail (info at kavasociety.nz) Our Vanuatu partners maintain robust records and can always track each batch to the area in which it was grown. Perhaps your experience may be related to factors relating to terroir/where kava is grown (and that's stuff not captured by the mere kavalactone data - who knows it's entirely possible or indeed likely other phystochemicals provide some synergy/entourage effect).

 

[yiki]

Sometimes it's a matter of different water to root ratio and pacing. Different kavalactones have different peak brain concentration times.

Both us and Kava Europe publish *all* COAs for every single batch we sell, so you can perhaps take note of specific batches/cultivars that hit the right spot to you and see if there was anything unique in the chemistry that may explain it (often times it's more on the consumers' body chemistry side). Beyond chemistry, if you ever encounter a batch you particularly like or dislike, drop me an e-mail (info at kavasociety.nz) Our Vanuatu partners maintain robust records and can always track each batch to the area in which it was grown. Perhaps your experience may be related to factors relating to terroir/where kava is grown (and that's stuff not captured by the mere kavalactone data - who knows it's entirely possible or indeed likely other phystochemicals provide some synergy/entourage effect).

I believe it really is a matter of timing, how the stomach reacts and water ratio. I found the less liquid the better, but one might not extract enough then, at least that is my fear. Would be cool if there was a way to find out how little water is actually needed to get 80% out. And then, the word "potency" is also a curious one as it can mean a lot of things. For me, i have grown to love strong, overwhelming kava effects that make you feel very "buzzy" so a body effect that is stimulating, not sedating. I do bevelieve many find this not enjoyable and claim it makes them anxious. I understand, i felt the same way years ago. I'm wondering if these kind of overwhelming buzzy kavas are slowly going extinct since the demand is not there? It would also explain why i feel kavas not potent anymore overall.

 

[nabanga]

Oh no, kl% is not agood i dicator at all.
One high yangonin kava was a bloody stimulant.
Dihydromethysticin is probably the long term unpleasant antipsychotic that is felt primarily throughout the next day, etc.

Mighty Roots caused me to experience relaxation in eyemuscles that made reading impossible in not that high dose, very unusual (and no way recreational) while Pacific Elixir is a very well rounded one for me, master of none but a really really well rounded universal no fault kava for me.

I had a bucket of mighty roots last night for the first time in a few years - half way through, the feeling of a heavy weight in the base of my gut was so strong that I vomited, which I haven't done since my Port Vila days (felt fine and was able to continue after). It is a heavy duty product alright. I find it is more palatable mixed 50/50 with something else like Birkar or Palarasul.

 

[yiki]

I had a bucket of mighty roots last night for the first time in a few years - half way through, the feeling of a heavy weight in the base of my gut was so strong that I vomited, which I haven't done since my Port Vila days (felt fine and was able to continue after). It is a heavy duty product alright. I find it is more palatable mixed 50/50 with something else like Birkar or Palarasul.

I understand, it is extremly bitter and hard to drink. Like as if you take a palatable Kava, let the sediment sink down and drink only the sludge. But half a liter of that. I guess to a degree that is difficult to avoid. Perhaps condensed by 50% and then mixed with some fruit juice would be workable. I'll give it another try soon.

 

[Orz[EST]]

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[Cheesecloth]

Man, now I feel like I paid too little for my kava considering all the TLC required from start to finish. I had no idea! Thanks for sharing