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Can I try KAVA again ?

H

Hans

Lovely people,
A few years ago I discovered KavaKava. I read a lot about it and finally ordered and used it. It was the holy grail for me I was no longer in pain and was able to sleep again. Until at some point (after about 1 month) I got a severe rash, I have not dared to use it since. but I also did not found an alternative (tried a lot) . Now I'm wondering if I should try it again. Will the rash come back again much severe? What did cause the rash an allergy or liver problem. which Kava is better or should I try tincture. Maybe someone has experienced the same or somebody has a advice. Greetings from the Netherlands.
Hans
 

Kava o'puss

Kava Curious
Something I posted at one time:

Same exact thing happened to me. After a few months of taking/making/trying various brands , etc., I finally fully felt the full calming/ wash-over/de- stress effects. Just after that, I became extremely itchy - like rolled around naked in a pile of poison ivy itchy. This lasted for days.Laid off the kava for about 2 weeks. Had some more, it felt very effective and shortly after I became very itchy again, but not quite as intense. Took a short break and eased back in to drinking it. A few years , and 100's of shells of kava later, it never happened again. This allergic type reaction seems to happen to a relatively small % of people after the kavalactones build up in your system for the very first time or build up again after a very long break. I worked through it and I am glad I did. Kava has been a great relaxant, great to chill in evening after long day , and a great sleep aid. I would strain well and stay away from micronized. I was (not exclusively tho) drinking micro when I had these allergic reactions. After my body got used to the build up of kavalactones, I have been fine. I guess people can have different levels of adverse reaction tho, so proceed with caution- I've read of this happening to several other people too, with the worst symptoms being very itchy skin, hives, puffy/swollen, which abated after ceasing use. It's an odd allergic reaction, as I've never heard of someone being allergic right after 1st use...only after the kavalactones build up for first time / or build up again after long break. Some people, including me, report reverse tolerance - minimal effect until kavalactones finally build up. The " I feel it now" seems to correspond with the allergic reaction for some. Finally, this is not dermo. Dermo is dry/flaking skin after regular, excessive use. I had this a bit, nothing too severe and really don't get it anymore.
 
H

Hans

Thank you for the detailed response, I actually also did use the micronised KAVA from KAVA KING. I did a scoop in the shaker whit water and consumed it.
So is this just a allergic reaction? No liver damage or something? Which KAVA should I use and how much a day? I hope so that I can use it again it did a lot for me.
 

Kava o'puss

Kava Curious
Yes,an allergic reaction. There is plenty of information, on this forum and elsewhere, that indicates there is probably no correlation between traditionally prepared kava root consumption and liver damage. I described my experience above. I imagine everyone could have different results, though. I use medium grind traditionally prepared (strainer bag) kava or use Aluballs. There are already good posts on this forum describing how to make kava with medium grind root; it is not difficult. There is a review section on the forum that includes reviews of many popular vendors' kava. Bula Kava House, Kava Vinaka, Squanch Kava, Kavatime, Kavafied, Kalm with Kava, Nakamel at Home, Root of Happiness, Kava Depot, GHK all have kava I have enjoyed. I just tried many kinds of kava to see which ones I liked. I started again (after reactions) slowly, like one shell. Most vendors list about 2 tablespoons of root to 8 ounces of water as one serving; that is about the ratio I use. I started back up with one shell in the evening and then two shells, and so on (about 20 minutes apart). I never consume the root, medium or microgrind. After my 3rd go-around with kava, I have not had any such rashes again, no matter how much I drink now. But, of course, cannot guarantee the same will work for you. Good luck. I would have been pretty disappointed if I kept getting a rash/ severe itchyness and couldn't continue to drink kava.
 
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H

Hans

Hi Kava o'pus,

Yesterday I ordered a bag powdered noble kava root premium from the brand Kona Kava from the USA.
Over here in the Netherlands it's not available. So this time no micronized !
I will mix it well with water and strain it very good then I will wait so the residu can sit on the bottom.
Then I will cross my fingers and try a half bowl.
I hope that this is a good KAVA i bought.
Which brand do you use "medium grind traditionally prepared"
I will order also a few aluballs they seem to be very convenient.
Thank you my friend for helping me whit this issue!

Have a nice day.
 

F3TU5

Kava Enthusiast
Kona kava is pretty shit for the price and quality I thought, never tried it though, if wrong someone let me know

Also idk if you got a rash from allergies or from how dry kava can make your body. This time around try and keep your skin and body hydrated and that should help a lot with minor side effects. But since you're going the medium grind route you should be good, hopefully lol
 

Nikki Collins

Kava Curious
Hi Kava o'pus,

Yesterday I ordered a bag powdered noble kava root premium from the brand Kona Kava from the USA.
Over here in the Netherlands it's not available. So this time no micronized !
I will mix it well with water and strain it very good then I will wait so the residu can sit on the bottom.
Then I will cross my fingers and try a half bowl.
I hope that this is a good KAVA i bought.
Which brand do you use "medium grind traditionally prepared"
I will order also a few aluballs they seem to be very convenient.
Thank you my friend for helping me whit this issue!

Have a nice day.
Let us know how it goes!
 
H

Hans

F3TU5...........what is in your opinion good shit for the money?
I do'nt know anything about brands , I only tried the KAVAKING micronized and then became the rash.
So I am depending on the internet and the brands that I can compare.
Kona Kava says:
Our Premium Noble Kava Root Powder has matured for over four years and is our strongest form of Kava root available. Our Premium Noble Kava Root is prized for its least bitter taste and the most pleasurable effects.* This root is a little pricier than our other Kava Root, but the 14%-16% kavalactone content is partly the reason, and it’s one of the sweetest-tasting Kava Root powders we have ever tried. We literally tried Kava from all over the world; from Hawaii, Fiji, Vanuatu, Tonga, New Guinea, and even Germany. We chose our favorite Noble Kava Powder out of all of them. Available only in small quantities, and always blended with Noble Kava root from Hawaii.

The chemotype is 2-4-3. what ever that means :wacky:

Greetings
Nice weekend!
 

Kava o'puss

Kava Curious
Kona Kava does not seem to be so well-regarded in this forum / other online reviews. I would imagine it's fine to drink, but any in the string of vendors I listed in the post above can probably give you more premium kava for about the same price. I have had both dermo (although just mild to moderate) after consitent use and the more rare allergic reaction (after 1st feeling the kava effects) and these are two distinctly different things. It seems, most people will not get the allergic reaction- like most people will not have skin reactions to certain foods, but some will; while a lot of people will get dermo with consistent use, especially if not strained properly. As I said tho, I only got the slight reddening / slightly raised hives/ extremely itchy skin (not dermo flaking) twice, very early in my kava consumption, and have not had it in the 4 years or so since.
 

Kava o'puss

Kava Curious
Here is someone else that had the same exact allergy symptoms that I had - and then, evidently, later had no allergic reaction. Looks like they attributed it to poor storage, but the kavas that caused my reactions were freshly opened bags from BKH, so I do not think storage was the issue- just an odd allergy.

 
H

Hans

When I started the KAVA I consumed 2-3 bowls every evening. Maybe I drank too much for a beginner and the wrong type of Kava.
I hope that my second try of kava will turn out well. (have too wait for package)
At the time I used KAVA I did't drink alcohol nor smoke for about a month I just drank a lot of water. My skin became a little itchy like you said KAVA O'pus.
Then I went to a party and drank a lot of alcohol for the first time after a month (because they didn't had KAVA)
The day after the party I had the rash all over my body.
I am wondering .........Could the alcohol caused the rash?
 

Kava o'puss

Kava Curious
Having alcohol with a lot of kava in your system (recent) can make your skin (only seen on the face) red/flush/hot for a few hours- not exactly a rash though.This can happen, especially with red wine, with just alcohol and no kava in your system, but recent kava in your system can make this worse or cause it to happen to someone who usually does not experience this reaction from alcohol. Again, personal experience...drank kava during the week, then red wine on Saturday...hot , red, flush face. Space days in between kava/alcohol...never drink both same day IMO.
 

Kava o'puss

Kava Curious
Google search:
Many people experience facial flushing when they drink alcohol. The technical term for this condition is “alcohol flush reaction.” ... ALDH2 is an enzyme in your body that helps break down a substance in alcohol called acetaldehyde. Too much acetaldehyde may cause a red face and other symptoms.

My guess is kava may be broken down by same enzyme. Therefore, the enzyme cannot keep up with processing both the kava and alcohol. Again, this can happen from alcohol alone, but my guess is both kava and alcohol in your system can make this worse....it did for me.
 

Kavadanpirate

Daniel21Hyatt
Lovely people,
A few years ago I discovered KavaKava. I read a lot about it and finally ordered and used it. It was the holy grail for me I was no longer in pain and was able to sleep again. Until at some point (after about 1 month) I got a severe rash, I have not dared to use it since. but I also did not found an alternative (tried a lot) . Now I'm wondering if I should try it again. Will the rash come back again much severe? What did cause the rash an allergy or liver problem. which Kava is better or should I try tincture. Maybe someone has experienced the same or somebody has a advice. Greetings from the Netherlands.
Hans
Drink water with kava, I've never heard of kava causing rashes. It may have been something else causing it. Definitely try it again, I'd try kavafied, kalm with kava, kava vinaka, and kava time products all are great.
 
H

Hans

Thank you dear members for all the good advise and support!
I learn a lot and this makes it a bit less scary to try it again.
KAVA O'puss I think you are right, the combination from both kava/alcohol in the system is not a good match.
 

Mo'iety

Kava Enthusiast
Kava seems to potentially activate mast cells, which could be behind the rash-like allergic reactions and potentiation of alcohol flush reaction in some people:

I am taking a break from kava at the moment after a few instances of kava trigger an exacerbation of my seasonal allergy symptoms after having a session (but not after every session, strangely). I am going to experiment with slowly adding kava back after grass pollen season when my allergy symptoms are less present.
 

Kava o'puss

Kava Curious
Good find, Mo'iety


The pathophysiological effects of Kava have been widely discussed. Chronic and heavy users of kava report various symptoms, including muscle degradation, reddening of the eyes, and rare incidences of severe hepatotoxicity have been documented (Brown, et al., 2007; Fu, et al., 2008; Kava, 2001; Lude, et al., 2008; Rowe, et al., 2011; Teschke, et al., 2011). Moreover, it is being increasingly recognised that chronic kava users commonly present with a scaling of the dermis similar in form to an icthyotic dermatitis (Fu, et al., 2008; Grace, 2005; Guro-Razuman, et al., 1999; Norton, et al., 1994). This is accompanied by hyper-pigmentation and there is no known mechanism for its development (Matsuda, et al., 2006; Ruze, 1990). Generally, ichthyoses involve defective keratin synthesis, cornification or desquamation (Shwayder, 2004). While mast cells are nest understood to direct skin remodelling in the context of both beneficial and pathological inflammations such as wound healing, various urticarias and eczema (Abraham, et al., 2010; Galli, et al., 2010), some studies have shown that mast cell derived factors can influence keratinocyte function (Harvima, et al., 2008; Kohda, et al., 2002). There are also reports of delayed hypersensitivity allergic skin reactions to kava, which present some contact dermatitis-like symptoms (Jappe, et al., 1998; Schmidt, et al., 2000). Mast cells are key players in delayed hypersensitivity reactions and in this paper we investigate whether mast cells are targets for any of the active components in kava.
 
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