Kava and ADHD?

[Lelle]

Hi guys, I'm new here but have been lurking for a bit.
I tried Kava once years ago just before it was banned from Health stores in the U.K. Too long ago and too small an amount to really recall how I felt.
Ive just ordered some to try out as I have fairly severe social anxiety issues. I use benzoids very occasionally when I just need a break from the relentlessness of it all but am hoping that Kava may be a natural alternative.
So, I also have ADHD, combined type but primarily inattentive.
There is info out there that says Kava is recommended for ADHD but I've also read that Kava reduces dopamine and ADHD is thought to be to do with dopamine deficiency / inefficient working of . . so I'm not sure how this works or if it's ok for me to take in light of this.
Anyone have any thoughts, insights, experience?
Thanks

 

[Zac Imiola (Herbalist)]

I would give it a go. Don't try to do your own understanding of a plants effect on your neurotrasmitters from the small body of research in that field. It may be true or not ... but the synergestic total effect a plant has cannot be reduced to a single thing like that and kava may reduce dopamine and help with add through some oddity of combinations in its chemistry and how it affects us.

Are you zoned out or too fast to pay attention?

 

[Deleted User01]

Welcome to the forum. Remember that everyone has the potential to react differently to kava. I would try it and see if it helps or not.

 

[chandra]

I have adhd as well. Kava is absolutely wonderful for social anxiety (any kind of anxiety). I work from home as a writer so it's very easy for me to notice what makes my adhd better or worse. Kava is a bit hit or miss on that for me. It can really help, or it can take away my motivation. What has helped me a lot with concentration is calaestrus seeds. They actually boost your concentration and memory. After about two weeks I began to notice a real difference . They are also said to be great for those who smoke pot and get brain fog the next day. I imagine it would work the same for a kava hangover. There are very few people that find kava isn't helpful for them. It's just a matter of figuring out the right strain and dosage

 

[VictoryRider]

Are you on ADHD meds (ritalin, dexadrine, etc.)? It seems like kava would work against those. I'm certainly
not an expert... but I thought that ADHD meds (stimulants, basically) work the "opposite" of how they work
for people without ADHD.

 

[Lelle]

Thanks for the welcome @Deleted User01

@Mrbinx69 Thank you. That's a very good point re the total effect of the plant. These things are far more intricate than can be fully understood. I'm definitely going to try and see how I go.
I'm hyper alert in some ways but get zoned out in others. I struggle with organisational stuff, focus and restlessness which leads to debilitating overwhelm.

I believe the anxiety is related to ADHD and early trauma which is somehow stored in my body. My nervous system seems to be constantly hyper alert. Diazepam really does help but I'm not keen on taking pharmaceuticals.

@VictoryRider, stimulants do have the opposite effect for people with ADHD. It was a revelation when I first tried them to find a calm stillness that I never usually experience.
I could still feel the anxiety in my body but it wasn't hooking into me in the same way. Hard to explain.
Unfortunately the meds give me some quite nasty side effects and so I'm keen to explore more naturopathic options. My thinking too is that on the face of it Kava and ADHD meds seem to be at odds with each other. I def wouldn't take together.

@chandra, that's interesting that Kava can either really help or hinder with your ADHD symptoms. Do you find that with other things?
I find with both caffeine and Diazepam the effect can be very different depending on my baseline state.
Interesting about the seeds. I'll look into them. What quantity do you take daily?

 

[PepperyPyrone]

Hi, this is all based on research knowledge and not experience. ADHD is a complex disregulation of the brain pre-frontal cortex (PFC), mainly involving collaborative regulation via norepinephrine (NE) and dopamine (DA). They call it an inverted U influence where too little and too much of each throws off cognitive concentration and activity. The PFC normally works well with moderate levels of both of these neurotransmitters, where NE enhances the attention signal "attention level" and DA suppresses the background noise signals "focus". Amphetamines and methylphenidate meds simply work in two different ways to prevent the re-uptake of DA and NE. Amphetamine can also enhance DA and NE secretion. Altogether, these meds increase DA and NE signaling in the PFC. Other ADHD meds (guanfacine and chlonidine) work directly on the ADRA2A NE receptor as agonists. Depending on your genetics, these systems may respond to these medications differently, requiring dosage adjustments. Kava primarily enhances the GABAergic system along with inhibiting the Ca/Na channels, giving most of the anxiolytic and sedative properties. Kava has also been shown to inhibit NE re-uptake and at low doses decrease dopamine and at high doses increase dopamine, both possibly having varying effects on the inverted U influence of the PFC. The anxiolytic and sedative effects might help too. In other words, if you find the right kava cultivar that helps your ADHD, it will be very dependent on dose. So start low and go slow to find out which amount works for you. Don't just try high levels of kava expecting ADHD relief. I have heard good things, and can also attest to this, about GHK's Honokane Iki helping with being able to focus on tasks. Too much might rock you to sleep, but at low levels I did notice great ability to focus and concentrate that lasted well into the next day with a wonderful afterglow. Good luck!

 

[ThePiper]

Try moi or mahakea from ghk for social anxiety and concentration. That's what works best for me on the job.

 

[chandra]

Yeah things like caffeine can go either way for me too. Mahakea is my personal favorite kava. It's balanced enough to relax you without making you lazy. My problem with kava and concentration is usually that sometimes it puts me in a good mood, but not in a work mood. It may work differently if it was a job where you had to work on a set schedule, but I don't have to work if I don't feel like it. With the seeds I just eat 5 to 10 in the morning. I started seeing benefits within a few days. I've tried taking more, but it doesn't seem to be any more effective. They come from India, and I've read that they sometimes eat 100 seeds a day. I think stress has a lot to do with it as well, and kava can help you reduce your overall stress levels even on the days that you don't drink it.

 

[Pat-Attack]

What has helped me a lot with concentration is calaestrus seeds.

Where do you buy them from, I'm interested in trying them

 

[Zac Imiola (Herbalist)]

Google shows nothing... literally except this forum

 

[Pat-Attack]

Google shows nothing... literally except this forum

well i think they misspelled it, it's also known as the intellect tree, I'm just wondering about a reliable source. also amazon sells the seeds, but they're for planting, I'm wondering if there's a difference... oh and apparently kava dot kom sells a liquid pill form on another stupid sister site

 

[Lelle]

Wow, thank you for the really informative post @PepperyPyrone. It's much appreciated and I will come back and refer to it again and try to absorb all the info. It would be amazing if I can find a cultivar that helps some of my other ADHD symptoms as well as the anxiety (although I'm not expecting this . . just anxiety relief would be amazing enough). Thanks also to you and @ThePiper) for the kava recommendations. it's so hard to know where to start as a newcomer. Do you think instant, micronised or medium would be my best bet?
I'm in the UK and GHK sadly can't ship here. I've written to ask if they would be ok for me to order and have it sent to a friend in the US to forward on. Fingers crossed.
In the meantime last week I ordered Kava Kwik from Kava Kauai and preordered some Malekula magic from GKE. I'm not sure if this was the best way to start? but had to jump in somewhere.

@chandra hmm, I can imagine the work mood thing could be a problem for me too. I'm a textile artist and work a couple of days from home. Productivity and focus are a big issue when i'm out of a set external schedule.
It's great that you've found the seeds so helpful. I'm going to try to get hold of some. They seem hard to come by.

 

[chandra]

I get them from Meridian Botanicals. The medium sized bag will last me for several months of taking them every day. Think it's about $10. As for getting started, you kinda have to just jump in and see what works for you . I would suggest medium grind. I think it gives you more balanced effects and more body and mind relaxation.