Just for the record.

[Gourmet Hawaiian Kava]

Hi everyone, it looks like kavasseur is showing how he has no grasp on the true goings on in the kava world. He just posted his most recent video Tanoa talk 4 part 2". There is so much that is so wrong in this video, I will actually start making videos of my own to point out where he is wrong and I will provide proof.
Anyway, there is something that he just plain misunderstands or can't understand so I want to clear things up. He said that I claim that the Mahakea I sell is 22% kavalactones or something like that and then he points out that my COA from True Kava shows 7% kavalactones. He even says that the 22% kavalactones is impossible and unheard of. Well here is the facts. The COA from True Kava was correct. The kavalactone content at that time was 7%, as I state on my website the kavalactone content can range from 7%-13%, this is the average for Mahakea. The kavalactones can change to a degree. Now to the 20% kavalactone claim. First of all, I never said that my Mahakea was 20% kavalactones, this is what you get when you go by hearsay and don't get the facts for yourself. I did however say that Papa Ele Ele can get to 20.8% kavalactones. This is not a false claim, it is well documented. And this was in reference to the book Hawaiian 'Awa, it has a chart of kavalactone tests done on all the different Hawaiian kava and some from the South Pacific. In this chart you will see for Papa Ele Ele and the kavalactone content I am talking about. These tests were done on many different kava's from many different farms in many different locations and growing conditions and the tests were done by Madis Botanicals, a company well versed in testing kavalactones. If you look at other test results in that book you will see kavalactone content can reach high depending on the way it was grown, where and the variety. This is just an example of how wrong he is in so much of what he says on his videos and his blog. He said 20% was impossible but it is not, he said that because he just wants to attack GHK mostly, then Tyre Kava and then The KavaForums.
I will address all the other things in my up coming videos, I will be doing this to combat this false information that he is putting out, I do not wish the new ones in the kava world do get wrong information, nor the not so new ones either. Thank you and aloha.

Chris

 

[kavamehameha]

Thanks Chris for your effort and this clarification. Please be assured that at least most at KavaForums support you and your work and always strive to judge things based on solid scientific evidence. You and many other people put so much energy into their work to provide good quality kava and reliable scientific data - in my opinion, this characterizes a strong and trustworthy community.

 

[Bula Kava House]

Well hold on a minute there. With all due respect, Chris, when you first started your online store, all your kavas showed between 16% and 22% kavalactones. I didn't take screenshots or anything, but anybody who remembers when you first opened for business should recall this. We've even had public conversations on this forum about the unusually high levels claimed. Over time, and after testing you've taken that information down, but it was there at one point. Honestly, I saw Doug talk about the Mahakea and was thinking, "I wonder why he's only talking about Mahakea."

I don't mean to start an argument, and I really don't like calling out other vendors publicly, but this is the truth and honesty is important.

*edit: The GHK kavalactone percentages originally claimed did not say something like "Mahakea can get up to 22%". Each item clearly claimed these very high percentages were in the product being ordered.

 

[Krunkaroo]

All I know is that Mahakea is a godly Kava.
If Papa Ele Ele has such high KL then I can take half as much to get to where I want to be. Lookin forward to trying it.

 

[Bula Kava House]

All I know is that Mahakea is a godly Kava.
If Papa Ele Ele has such high KL then I can take half as much to get to where I want to be. Lookin forward to trying it.

I'm glad you like it, and I'm not saying that lower kavalactone contents mean bad quality. They don't. People apparently like GHK kava, and that's great. But the truth is that all products previously were falsely marketed to have ridiculously high kavalactone content. Actual kavalactone content has shown to be between 4% and 11%, I believe.

 

[Krunkaroo]

I'm a noob, can't TK verify KL % on the batches they test? That would be cool.

I know that it takes a lot more Mahakea to get me Krunked than let's say Squanch or TFR but there is something about Mahakea that gives me a subtle soft meditative perspective. Just wondering what that may be so I can hone in on that type of kava.

I'm glad you like it, and I'm not saying that lower kavalactone contents mean bad quality. They don't. People apparently like GHK kava, and that's great. But the truth is that all products previously were falsely marketed to have ridiculously high kavalactone content. Actual kavalactone content has shown to be between 4% and 11%, I believe.

 

[verticity]

Human memory is a funny thing.

@Bula Kava House , the statement "all your kavas showed between 16% and 22% kavalactones" is false.

However, @Gourmet Hawaiian Kava you did used to claim that your Mahakea had 19% kavalactones (not 22%). But, Judd, he also had lower numbers listed, so it's not true all the numbers were high. For example: Mapulehu: 8%, Opihikao: 13%, Boroguru: 11%. As I recall, the Mahakea was the only one that had a really high number, and Chris fixed that a couple years ago, so this is really all much ado about nothing. Also there is no proof that that 19% number was false for that batch. There are examples in the peer reviewed literature of numbers that high, although it is unusual. And I don't need to rely on my memory. Here is a screenshot from the Wayback machine from Oct. 11, 2014 for example:
https://web.archive.org/web/20141011235659/http://www.gourmethawaiiankava.com:80/4.html

 

[verticity]

Let me also say:

If you guys want to discuss every inaccurate statement or photograph that has ever appeared on the American Kava Association website, or on the web sites of AKA members, or inaccurate statements made by AKA members in the foreign or domestic media, I don't want to go there, but I can if pushed.

 

[Bula Kava House]

@verticity You'd have to go back further. This screenshot is newer. Boroguru wasn't an original offering. This screenshot is after Chris changed most of his claims. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like we have an archive of the original products. All the kava's listed were very high. At least this screenshot does show his statement about the Mahakea was false.

And how do we know that a single batch wasn't 19%? We don't, but not a single batch has tested anywhere near that since then. Also, I've seen hundreds of HPLCs of kavas in the past six years from all over the kava growing world. None have exceeded 14%.

 

[verticity]

@verticity You'd have to go back further. This screenshot is newer. Boroguru wasn't an original offering. This screenshot is after Chris changed his claims. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like we have an archive of the original products. All the kava's listed were very high.

And how do we know that a single batch wasn't 19%? We don't, but not a single batch has tested anywhere near that since then. Also, I've seen hundreds of HPLCs of kavas in the past six years from all over the kava growing world. None have exceeded 14%.

It definitely is possible that that 19% number was not accurate. However, there is no proof of that. That is a single number from a couple years ago, I don't see the point of making a big deal about it now. It was probably an honest mistake, or maybe it was the real number. People make mistakes. And memory is not perfect. I'm all for giving everyone involved here the benefit of the doubt.

 

[verticity]

Clarification: Above I was not referring to Bula Kava House. I was referring to other AKA members, and the AKA web site itself, which have made inaccurate statements. The only verifiable falsehood I am aware of by BKH was the claim a couple years ago that Koniak was noble, although that was not what I had in mind in my comment above.

 

[Bula Kava House]

It definitely is possible that that 19% number was not accurate. However, there is no proof of that. That is a single number from a couple years ago, I don't see the point of making a big deal about it now. It was probably an honest mistake, or maybe it was the real number. People make mistakes. And memory is not perfect. I'm all for giving everyone involved here the benefit of the doubt.

So he used to grow all this kava around 20% then all of the sudden it all dropped to 5-10%? Tragic.

Look, if Chris just said, "Oops, my fingers slipped while typing up the description of all my products. Sorry about that." I wouldn't say anything, but he's saying he never made those claims. That's not true.

 

[Bula Kava House]

Clarification: Above I was not referring to Bula Kava House. I was referring to other AKA members, and the AKA web site itself, which have made inaccurate statements. The only verifiable falsehood I am aware of by BKH was the claim a couple years ago that Koniak was noble, although that was not what I had in mind in my comment above.

Thanks. As for the Koniak, we all make mistakes. I thought it was noble for a while. Turns out it wasn't. People sure liked it though!

 

[Krunkie McKrunkface]

Fwiw, even as a noob I've learned that the tested kavalactone content of a particular cultivar or harvest doesn't really tell me how good a kava is, nor how much I will enjoy it. The numbers are interesting, but I think it is a grave mistake to pass over a perfectly wonderful kava because the numbers indicate it might not be "strong enough" to give perfect satisfaction. Neither is a high number any guarantee of a wonderful experience.

And of course, one can simply vary the grind : water ratio, as one should anyway, to get the desired effects. E.g usually my first wash of a cup of root is 5 or 5.5 cups with a second wash of 3 cups, and typically 2 cups on the 3rd and 1 or 2 on the fourth. But with the mahakea/kumakua blend I started yesterday, 1st wash was 6 cups and 2nd was 4 cups and if anything those more "dilute" washes were stronger than my usual grogs! And gosh golly but all of it is awesome, primo kava drinking, among the very best I have ever experienced.

I guess I'm saying that as a punter much of this really means nothing to me in the kojo kontroversies. It's either good kava or it isn't. I don't care if it's from Vanuatu or what the posted kavalactone content is ( the words strong and mild and heady and heavy convey all I want to know and I can take it from there or ask someone I trust who has had it). I guess I also want to know if it'll make you sick. That's about it.

 

[verticity]

So he used to grow all this kava around 20% then all of the sudden it all dropped to 5-10%? Tragic.

Look, if Chris just said, "Oops, my fingers slipped while typing up the description of al my products. Sorry about that." I wouldn't say anything, but he's saying he never made those claims. That's not true.

Technically I understood he was saying he did not remember making those claims, which I am willing to believe. But Ill let Chris speak for himself about that.

 

[verticity]

Thanks. As for the Koniak, we all make mistakes. I thought it was noble for a while. Turns out it wasn't. People sure liked it though!

I really do appreciate your candor on that point. And also I need to say I am impressed by the efforts you have made to source high quality noble kava since then. Full disclosure: I am an occasional (very satisfied) BKH customer.

 

[TheKavaFlow]

Thanks. As for the Koniak, we all make mistakes. I thought it was noble for a while. Turns out it wasn't. People sure liked it though!

It looks like GHK has also made mistakes in the past by listing KL% around 20%, and has since corrected it. You going to keep harassing him about it?

Might I add, I've never experienced tudei effects from GHK's products (regardless of his marketing material), but I did from Koniak.

 

[Gourmet Hawaiian Kava]

@verticity You'd have to go back further. This screenshot is newer. Boroguru wasn't an original offering. This screenshot is after Chris changed most of his claims. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like we have an archive of the original products. All the kava's listed were very high. At least this screenshot does show his statement about the Mahakea was false.

And how do we know that a single batch wasn't 19%? We don't, but not a single batch has tested anywhere near that since then. Also, I've seen hundreds of HPLCs of kavas in the past six years from all over the kava growing world. None have exceeded 14%.

Judd, please do not post here anymore on my topics. It is clear that you never read the book that I mentioned in this article, you say that you have seen hundreds of HPLC tests on kava and have never seen tests above 14% when the book proves that they can. I have seen thousands of HPLC tests in my over 30 years in the kava world and I can tell you that they do. You have always disliked me and you still seem to dislike me by the way your comments "seem" antagonistic and your not willing to see the proof. Thank you Judd.

Chris

 

[Bula Kava House]

It looks like GHK has also made mistakes in the past by listing KL% around 20%, and has since corrected it. You going to keep harassing him about it?

Might I add, I've never experienced tudei effects from GHK's products (regardless of his marketing material), but I did from Koniak.

Chris started a post saying that he didn't claim his kavas were listed as that high. He was being dishonest to forum members. If he had said that he made a mistake and had listed incorrect percentages, that would be different.

Koniak- Yeah, I just said it wasn't noble, so if you experienced some tudei like effects, that doesn't surprise me.

 

[Gourmet Hawaiian Kava]

So he used to grow all this kava around 20% then all of the sudden it all dropped to 5-10%? Tragic.

Look, if Chris just said, "Oops, my fingers slipped while typing up the description of all my products. Sorry about that." I wouldn't say anything, but he's saying he never made those claims. That's not true.

Judd, again you did not read the evidence. The kava in Hawaii that has tested very high has been grown and pampered in kava experts yards at there home. If you don't understand what can make the kavalactone high it is not my fault. The thing is that it does happen and it takes a lot of work. Kava I grow at my home can get very high in kavalactones and that is one of the early ones that I offered and it did have high kavalactones. After that I started selling only kava from my farms and sometimes will offer kava from my house.
Ed Johnston is also known for growing kava with kavalactones that are high. It happens, it is true and all I said was true.
This post was to explain that Kavasseur was wrong and now i have to explain again to you. NO! go read for yourself.

Chris