Krunkie McKrunkface
Kava Connoisseur
we have the equivalent of malt liquor, and it lasts a whole two days!
kastom_lif
Kava Lover
I guess sometimes people just want to get messed up. Been there, done that... I much prefer waking at dawn feeling happy and refreshed.
No Edward Isahands for me, thanks.
No Edward Isahands for me, thanks.
SelfBiasResistor
Persist for Resistance!
They are definitely targeting that trendy hipster crowd but are still at a disadvantage compared to a high end beer bar or coffee shop where everyone knows what it is and being in a convenient location alone can drive up business. Based on the availability and quality of the noble powder available to consumers right now, I don't think there would be enough of a supply, anyway.
Hopefully a little insider info will help clear something up here, because there seems to be a misconception. Kava bars stay in business because of regular customers. About 70-80% of our sales are people that drink kava daily or nearly every day. They are educated kava drinkers who know good kava. Sure we get people that just want a one time experience, and tourists, but that's not the the normal customer. We get to give the "kava schpiel" far too infrequently.
I have visited and know the owners of quite a few other bars as well and their sales are also very much community driven. This also applies to bars where the majority of sales is K@.
I have visited and know the owners of quite a few other bars as well and their sales are also very much community driven. This also applies to bars where the majority of sales is K@.
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I'm not sure what the old Tyler quote was for, but I disagree with him that a half shell of tudei would make anybody sick. That casts a wide and inaccurate net. I won't speak for him, but I might guess that he too now realizes that there are some pretty pleasant tudei kavas, when used in moderation.
Anyway, the vast majority of kava/K@ bars, if I had to guess I'd say 80%+, serve one type of kava, purchased from one of two sources. Both of those sources supply noble kava.
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kasa_balavu
Yaqona Dina
Thanks for joining this discussion, Judd.
The AKA made a submission to the Vanuatu kava meeting which contained significant claims about the breadth of the US industry that the AKA represents. As the only AKA board member active on KF, would you be kind enough to produce a list of members? Were the members asked whether they should make this submission to the Vanuatu govt, or was this a unilateral decision by Blythe?
I'm tempted to join so that I can demand to see the list of members, meeting minutes, etc. There appears to be no transparency whatsoever around this organization.
The AKA made a submission to the Vanuatu kava meeting which contained significant claims about the breadth of the US industry that the AKA represents. As the only AKA board member active on KF, would you be kind enough to produce a list of members? Were the members asked whether they should make this submission to the Vanuatu govt, or was this a unilateral decision by Blythe?
I'm tempted to join so that I can demand to see the list of members, meeting minutes, etc. There appears to be no transparency whatsoever around this organization.
SelfBiasResistor
Persist for Resistance!
That's interesting to know. Did many of those regular customers know about kava before finding it at BKH?
verticity
I'm interested in things
I get it that there is resentment there about foreigners stealing unique things from them that are part of their national identity. But in this case it seems like a few foreigners are trying to exploit that resentment, and turn it against other foreigners for their own benefit. The article doesn't say what anyone else said at that meeting, but I do hope they listen to everyone and come to a decision that is in their own best interest.Latest news from Vanuatu Daily Post: Minister opens Kava Industry Meeting
Excerpt:
On CODEX and Kava Dossier: “The classification of the varieties of kava from the above exercise meant that only the noble varieties were the subject of the kava Codex. This has huge economic and financial implications for the country in terms of potential foregone revenue and income and as such represents too significant a cost for Government to just take a back seat.
“Without conclusive, empirical ad scientific evidence regarding the harmful effects of the tudei and medicinal varieties, it is the ministry’s view that further work is required to;
• Place more emphasis on research into these two aforementioned
• Emanating from this research, a determination of the viability of their inclusion in the Kava Dossier and the Codex document
• Ensure that any pharmaceutical and or pharmacopedic potential of the naturally occurring chemicals in all or kava and their extracts are patented to the Republic of Vanuatu.
So basically he's saying that all work done by the experts in the last ~20 years is crap, and they'll make up their own mind. And he expects the Codex Commission will accept whatever conclusion the Ministry arrives at, and just blindly include it...Oh, and he wants a patent on every molecule in kava. I'm not seeing any of this as even remotely realistic, and I'm really not sure why Shing would either.
The story of the foreigner who came to Pentecost, "stole" bungee jumping from them and patented it is an interesting case. It sounds peculiar, but there is actually something to it and a legitimate grievance. The legal claim in the bungee jumping case probably wouldn't be recognized by a foreign country, just as it probably would not be possible to patent naturally occurring flavokavains, but the sentiment, the mixture of pride and resentment behind it, reflects a long history and should be respected:
http://world.time.com/2013/08/01/af...bungee-jumpers-may-get-financial-recognition/
The VanPo posted this letter as well. The author is not named but I'm guessing is Michael Louze of the Vanuatu Kava Industry Group (?), which argues the other side:
http://dailypost.vu/opinion/letters...cle_18b42e3a-5b99-52c7-93ec-9ac18c99f663.html
"The Ministry of Agriculture should stop listening to two-day Kava promoters and take a decisive stand against this nonsense once and for all. It is very insulting to read that buyers in Europe would opt to import kava from other countries such as Samoa rather than Vanuatu when the entire planet knows that Vanuatu is the home of kava in the world.
Moreover, it was Vanuatu, through its former Ambassador to the EU Mr Joy, who fought relentlessly to have the decade-long unjustifiable and unscientifically-backed kava ban lifted and quashed by the German courts. We struggled through numerous negotiations, time, money and a lot more challenges through this battle which a lot of government officials even within the Ministry of Agriculture and Trade know nothing about.
The last thing we want to see is another ban imposed on Vanuatu over the attitude of a few exporters who are still exporting two-day kava abroad at the expense of the good name, image and reputation of the Vanuatu Government and its entire kava industry. The fact that some EU importers are using this as an excuse should also send a very clear warning to the Vanuatu Government to stop mucking around and get its acts together over this issue once and for all. A national industry cannot be held at ransom just to satisfy the interests of a handful of two-day kava growers and promoters just like that. This is totally unacceptable and insulting against the Government and kava growers around this country."
Most knew very little. We try to educate, and once people get into it they tend to go off and do their own research as well.
Elias
Newbie
Praveens Kava from Navua bulk buy majority Tudei and then blend it with Kadavu. He been doing this for years. He buys at $20kg(Tudei)
People drink his kava like it' going out of fashion. They don't say anything is wrong with it(headaches,Nausea,vommiting) even though upto 80% of all his powdered material is Tudei.
He making a killing bro!!
People drink his kava like it' going out of fashion. They don't say anything is wrong with it(headaches,Nausea,vommiting) even though upto 80% of all his powdered material is Tudei.
He making a killing bro!!
kasa_balavu
Yaqona Dina
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Scientists react to kava concerns
German scientist Dr. Mathias Schmidt, the man who, with former Vanuatu Ambassador to the European Union, Roy Mickey Joy and Italian international trade lawyer, Paolo Bergano, had worked tirelessly to convince a German Administrative Court to lift the kava ban from the Pacific on the EU market last year, says he will no longer advocate buying kava from Vanuatu.
He says his move is to protect European kava importers.
He is importing his kava from Samoa, Tonga and Fiji saying they have no two-day kava there.
“I won’t risk the very fragile situation in Germany with the alleged discovery of two-day junk, including peelings instead of noble kava roots in a delivery”, he says.
Recalling the critical period which resulted with the kava ban in 2002, Dr. Schmidt says the problem with kava exports to Europe came up because Vanuatu sold poor quality kava to a German manufacturer.
The scientist says he was convinced that at the time it was not intentional. “Vanuatu rightfully complained and even wanted to start a WTO procedure. A precondition for that was that Vanuatu would have to be blameless when it comes to quality”, he says.
“There were not, and things got worse. Until now Vanuatu could not least say that the problem with kava was the result of some semi-criminal activities, but now they cannot do that any longer.
“If anything happens again it will be their responsibility and theirs alone. Too bad that it will not only hurt the Vanuatu economy again, but also the economy of Fiji, Samoa and Tongoa.
“And by the way, we do not even have to wait for another report of liver failure. Just the proof of presence of bad quality kava will be sufficient to trigger reactions from the EU regulators – and the media”.
As for Dr. Vincent Lebot who is an authority on kava, he is on the Board of the Vanuatu Agriculture Research Training Centre (VARTC).
The scientist’s work is fully funded by the French Government to conduct research in the country to assist growers.
He is aware of concerns that his work is not conclusive. He says people are entitled to their own views and welcomes them to click on his website: http://publications.cirad.fr/auteur.php?mat=1389 to have access to his papers.
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From http://dailypost.vu/news/scientists...cle_60a8996c-4be8-513d-a21b-c170681161c3.html
verticity
I'm interested in things
It should be noted that Dr. Schmidt is not a government official. He can't dictate a German or European ban on importing kava from Vanuatu to governments or pharmaceutical companies (other than his own company), but he is an influential kava expert in the private sector, so his recommendation will carry a lot of weight.
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SelfBiasResistor
Persist for Resistance!
Vanuatu won't have problems selling their root. There are plenty of buyers (in existing markets) that are not Euro pharmaceutical companies. What we do need is for Europeans to be able to freely choose what kava they want to purchase or medicate with and not be dependent on doctors and drug companies.
It's also risky for the future legality of kava to refer to any variety as being dangerous without concrete evidence. Neither noble or tudei should be mentioned in the same context as stems and peelings.
It's also risky for the future legality of kava to refer to any variety as being dangerous without concrete evidence. Neither noble or tudei should be mentioned in the same context as stems and peelings.
verticity
I'm interested in things
That's exactly it. The demand made by the Ministry in the correspondence above is essentially "Show us proof that tudei kava is dangerous, otherwise we will go ahead and export it" is exactly the wrong question, and not what regulators care about. From the the importing countries regulators perspective, they would say "Show us a compelling preponderance of evidence that the product you are selling to us is safe and effective; otherwise, we won't accept the risk."
In the case of noble kava, a compelling preponderance of evidence does exist for it's safety and effectiveness. In the case of tudei, that is much harder to justify. Saying that tudei lacks noble's proven track record is completely different from saying that tudei is proven to be dangerous. In fact, tudei has been proven neither dangerous nor safe.
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SelfBiasResistor
Persist for Resistance!
You don't become more free by giving up your existing freedom. That has been done many times in the past with disastrous consequences. What is irresponsible is planting the seed in peoples mind that kava of any kind is dangerous.
K2/Spice was never a good product so it shouldn't even be in the discussion. The freedom to use the plants provided to us by nature has helped the situation with K@ so far. The DEA failed to complete their ban last year due to the pressure put on them. Sure, they may move forward and ban it but that could still have consequences since they are not allowed to ban just any substance they see fit without congressional approval. As far as the FDA goes, it doesn't exist to keep us safe and ensure only safe and effective products are sold. They are under heavy influence from industry and if those industries begin to lose out on profits, there is no reason to think the FDA will not turn on kava. We really shouldn't be giving them any ammunition to use against us at some point in the future.
Also look at the legal cannabis movement. It's spreading like wildfire and there isn't approval from the federal regulatory agencies.
nabanga
Kava Enthusiast
There's some further info on the meeting outcome and why they excluded the media in this morning's release:
http://dailypost.vu/news/a-more-inc...l&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=user-share
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http://dailypost.vu/news/a-more-inc...l&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=user-share
Sent from my BLL-L22 using Tapatalk